4、《听说大突破》2册2.Religion and Philosophy压吗听懂练习

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1、2册2.Religion and Philosophy 2A 开始到14分40秒的语音对应文本
                     
                      2. Religion and Philosophy

SIDE A


Vivian:

O.K. Here we are again, gang.

Luke:

Hey!
Daisy:

Hey!
Bow:

What's up?

Vivian:

And, and I guess we're talking today about, 。。。。maybe one step further after marriage,
may be religion 。。。and tie that together。。。 with so me philosophy,
....uh...hey, gang,.... let's introduce each other..., Daisy?

Daisy:

O.K. This is Daisy here,... back at you, ....once again..... and this conversation ....we're having about religion ....and philosophy......
..... This is a deep one, ....over to you, Bow?

Bow:

Yes,.... Hi, my name is Bow,.... studied architecture .....but philosophy is ....very interesting.... to me ...and I used to.... study about religions, too.

Luke:

This is Luke, ....urn, I don't know,.... I'm just really happy to be here,
.....I hope I can glean ....a lot of information from...., from my peers..... I'm always interested ....in finding new mentors ....and different ideas,
.....I, to fill,.... to fill my head,.... you know,.... I'm really looking forward to it, ....should be fun.

Vivian:

Hey, ...this is Vivian,.... I'm not that ...religious anymore
......, but I feel that..... there are certain things.... that I, .....seek... religion for,
....I used to be.... very religious..... and so this should be.... a very insightful .....conversation ...for me.

Daisy:

You know, ....what's quite fascinating, ...here in Korea, ....
.....it's a common thing to ....ask people ....when you first meet them,
....."What is your religion?" ....But.... in my country ....and I know .....also in your countries as well,
..... it's actually quite ....a personal question, ...right?

Vivian:

Definitely, .....yeah, you just couldn't go up to stranger ....and just ask....
..... "So are you Christian? ....Are you, ....which church do you go to?"
.....I get that a lot of myself, ....and I, ....sometimes I,.... I guess the reason why, ...
.....this is rude is because ......you don't really want to ....expose yourself,
.....(Sure) and your beliefs.... to someone,..... especially someone ...you don't know.

Luke: I

t's a very personal experience ...for everyone...... I'm not offended ....by that question personally,
.....but it is a very personal ...thing.... to a real stranger.

Bow:

And I think,.... actually, ....in the States,.... if someone comes up to you... and asks like
..... "Are you a christian" ...or this and that, ...you kinda think.... that they're a Jesus freak.

Daisy:

Right.

Bow:

You know why, ....it's somebody ....that is really interested.... in religion ...
....and you're like, ....why are you asking me this,... you must be really weird.

Vivian:

And also, ...I guess,... people get very sensitive.... to questions like that,
.... obviously, ....because of our cultures, ....
.....it's not acceptable for ....someone to just go up... to someone
...."How old are you?,... Are you married? ...How much do you make?,... What religion are you?"
.....And I guess religion, ...especially, ....for those who are religious, ....
.....it becomes a very sensitive topic,... it's a hot issue.
.... (Daisy: Right) ....Ah, ....which I guess brings us to.... an obvious question?
.... Are you religious, ...what religion are you?

Bow:

Well,.... let's see, ....I went to a catholic school..... for fourteen years,
..... my parents... are Irish catholic,.... and my grandparents, ....we used to go to church but,
..... once I got to college..... I didn't believe that ....catholicism was the
....., um,well, ....had everything that I,.... thought it, ....should have,.... so kind of
....., now I like to learn about.... many religions, .
...because ...I think ....every religion has its good aspects ....and its bad aspects.

Vivian:

Could I ask what ....exactly ...was the turning point?
.... Why you thought... that really wasn't,... you were fulfilling?

Bow:

....Um, that's a good question,.... I think, ...maybe because,... for example,
....in the catholic church, ...you're, ....they have like ...the Ten Commandments ....
....and if you break one of these commandments ....then you're not supposed to.... receive the body of Christ.
....Right? So,... but like in my community, ....like I knew... these guys ....are like cheating ....on their wives
....which was breaking ...that commandment,.... but they would go up and receive communion
....and just ....because it looked good, ...and other people would think... that they don't sin,
....so it was just kinda like a social thing, ...more that a religious thing for them.

Vivian:

Right,... so it's not a serious.

Bow:

Right.

Daisy:

.... Well, ...I was also raised in a very..,.... generations in,... I don't know... how many generations,
... but it's been a long time, ...a very strict catholic family, ...
.....and my father.... has never missed... going to mass, ....one Sunday ...in his life, ...he's sixty- four years old.
...And urn,.... I also, as a child... I think about ...the age of fourteen
.... began to see that ....type of hypocrisy, ...in the church,
.... especially ....with the parish members ....and the one thing.... that really kind of turned my stomach is,
....I would watch them.... reciting the prayers.... that you have to.... recite during the mass,
....and they were just doing simply that, ....it's was kind of like... a parrot,
...you know, ....repeating everything ...you say, ...they weren't.... thinking about ...the words,
.... they weren't thinking about.... what they were saying,
.... they were just saying them.... and they do stuff like ....that on the weekend. ...You know bad things.

Bow:

...Yeah,... Well, I think like,.... because, ....if they're christian or Catholic.... then they think that... by doing this,
....that saves them, ....they're gonna go into heaven, ...and they're..,
.....but the thing is for me, ....once I get older, ....I thought like, ....
....well, is the Bible really telling true stories? ....Is it really a heaven?..
.... When you start to learn.... about other religions, ....where the Buddhists think.... that you're kinda reincarnated ....and there's a cycle of life,
.... and who says that.... the Catholics are right? ....The Buddhists are wrong, ....or Buddhists are right ...and Catholics are wrong,
.... who actually knows? ....Nobody can really give an answer so, ....for these people... to just do that it's like.... making excuse ....and I'll just take my chances ....and it seems like... the best thing,
.... so I'm just gonna go to church, ...you know, ....even though they don't really ....believe any of the philosophies of the church,
....but by doing that then,.....they're saved, ...so to speak.

Vivian:

....Yeah, I agree..... I think it was ....the hypocrisy theory ...for me
...., I totally thought ....it was just a all..... Well, ....my mother is very, ....very religious and very,
....christian even till this day, ....and my sister ....and my mom do... not miss one Sunday,
....actually they're.... at church five days a week almost,... and I was too, ....until I guess I was in about junior high?
.....And then ....after that.... I got to thinking myself,.... "well,.... church is almost,
.... you know.... it's a thing.... that you are kinda forced... to attend,
..... and I thought ....I believed.... in the Bible ...and everything,...
.... but then once you get a little older, ....and your mind is more developed ...and you go to school
....., and you learn more things you come to realize....
...."well, for me ...I want scientific proof, ...a base to, ...you know,... formulate...., for example,
....is the Bible,.... are the stories.... in the bible true?.... Did Jesus ..
......you know, ....come to earth ...and were the disciples really there?
..... and then you have .....the science that says-- actually ....man came from this... and that in ..
......that's I guess, ...what sort of, ...kinda of weaned me off of christianity.

Bow:

....Well, ...I have this theory,.... if you think about ...how was religion invented ....or thought up,
.... like the first.... humans stood erect, ....then a...... you know, ...once they had the capacity to think,
.....they had a capacity, ...we still do now,... if you talk about... in the scientific aspect,
.... we think ...in a linear way... from a to b, ....we always think... in time... from a to b,
.... so, ....the first person ....who had the ability to... think that way,... they went back... and said like,
...."I'm a person now... in this time, ...how did I get here,... where did I come from?",
.... and because of that,.... lack of brain power,... then religion was invented, ...because ... if there's a ...
....if you could think ....in kind of like.... a z-access,.... or another dimension,
....maybe you could figure it out, ...but we can't, ...so.... religion was invented,
.... because of that reason, ...so that you wouldn't go crazy ...thinking about ...where did I come from,
....and the ... physicist Stephen Hawking,.... he wrote this book.... "Brief History of Time"
.... and you know, ...usually scientists.... are also, ....atheist,...
.... they don't believe ....in anything ....because they're always looking for facts.
.... And this guy, ...he wen.t..... back ....and mathematically calculated the big bang,
.... the beginning of universe, .....but at the end of the book he says..
.... "and I believe in god" ....because he can't go back... any further mathematically,
....because he only has a capacity.... to thin...k from a to b in a linear sense.

Daisy:

....Right,... but also,.... basic,.... especially the christian religions,
....and.., saying christian religions.... that can encompass anything .....from Jehovah's Witnesses,
.... to the Seventh Day Adventists, ...catholic,... protestant, ...whatever.
....If you, ....generally,... if the concept of those religions ....is correct,
.... if you are questioning,... urn, ...if the stories... in the Bible... are right, ...or if Jesus did exist,
.... then what you are essentially doing,... is completely veering away.... from the essence of your religion,
.....because if it's based on the fact of faith, ....which asks you ...to believe... with no proof.
....So therefore.... if I'm to be, ...a part of those religions,...
.... but I have an intelligent brain ....and I have questions ...to ask,
.... then therefore.... I'm not religious? .
....Because I question... my faith ....or I don't have faith ...because I question it?

Vivian:

....Well,.... my mother would skin my hide.... if I were to say this.
..... And I voiced this to her ....and before I've gotten ...in really big trouble with her,
.... and I've said... this to other people, ....it's gotten me ...in sticky situations,... myself,
.... but I'm at a very happy medium..... I've come to ....a good understanding ....of where I am.
.....I'm not religious ....enough to believe.... in all the stories... in the bible,
....and go to church,... thinking that.... I'm gonna follow the preacher... and sing these song,
....but I tell you what,... when I go to church ...and when I leave church,
....I leave with a good feeling, ...I feel renewed,... I feel like ....I wanna go out ...and do a good deed,
.... but that's not........ because I'm religious ....and I believe... in God.
.... I'm not saying ...I don't believe.. in God, ...but I'm saying,.
.... you do whatever.... that makes you feel good, ....and if it brings you.... to the point where
...."gosh, ...I wanna go out, ...and do a good deed today,.... I really regret doing something,... yesterday,
..... and also the stories.... in the bible like.... I said.... I don't believe in them,
.... but they give me a nice, ...which foundation ...for morals or what's not.

Daisy:

Right.

Bow:

....Well, I think urn,.... in every religion, ...like a,.... some people choose... this only one,
... you know, ....religion catholic ...or whatever, ....but I think within all the religions,
.... many things are the same,... they're just interpreted ....in different ways,
....so like, ....for example ....most religions have something to do ....with what we call in christianity,... the soul.
.... In Asia,.... they call the spiritual energy ...or GI,....
.... and where that energy, ....that energy goes somewhere ...after it leaves your body,
....so.... there's different words for it, ...but,.... they're pretty much talking about ...the same thing.

Luke:

....Yeah, ....basically organized religion.... at its best,... at its purist,....
..... is a community of people ....who kind of ....believe in the same kind of idea,
.... but it's a way of.... bringing people together ....and agreeing on ...how to live just lives... and noble lives,
....and it sort of .....keeps people on a track,.... on an enlightened track, ....and a track of ...benevolence ...and good will.

Vivian:

.....Shoot me ....for saying this ....but I,.... sometimes.... get to a point... where I kinda think ...those people especially,
....having seen ....the Korean community going to church ....and where they're just really,
....really into it. ....They really religious ones, ....they sit there ....and cry ...and wail ...and anyway
....i just get to a point ...where I think,.... well they kinda ...rely on this church... and each other... and this religion... for like,
.... it's kind of like a backbone... in their lives, ...or else they couldn't go on.

Daisy:

.... Well, ....for me... I have a problem.... with the concept of religion,.... basically, ...because of what I was saying before,
.... because it's supposed to be based, ...based on faith ...only... which...., in philosophy,
....they say that ....christianity is ....based on the theory ...that God is good, ....and God is good... because he is God,
....so therefore ...if I,... totally absorbed that... with faith,.... that theory,..
.... then I'm not given ....any allowance... to be human... and question ....why God is good.
.... If I wish to, ...um use the brain.... that God has supposedly given me,
....then I should be able to analyze.... that and decide ...why God is good ....and why I should ....worship God.
....So, ...in that case,.... I thinks religion just.... is anti-christian,
.... because ....it doesn't allow you ....to use your God-given talents.

Vivian:

.....Isn't that the reason..... why there's so many religions.... that have developed over a long time,
.... because.... you find some sort of discrepancy ....or something that.. you don't approve of,
....or can't come to terms with. .....So you turn to ...a similar religion,...
.... for example, ....you mentioned christianity,... christianity involves ...so many different religions.
....I didn't really have a nice,.... understanding of.... it until I hit high school,
.... but before then like.... I said.... that I followed my mom to church thinking ....christians are christians,
....but there's catholics,.... there's protestants, ...there's Presbyterians,... what is the difference?
....Little discrepancies.... in the Bible.

Bow:

....Yeah, that's, ....that's what I was gonna point out, ..
......It's like ...how can people make this ....and why is this religion christianity.... so widespread in the world,
.....when their backbone.... as you call is like ..
......based on the Bible ....which is just full of contradictions
.... (Daisy: Sure)... it's all, ....it's written by ....so many different writers... and like it's,
.... for example,... "love your brother, ....love yourself" ....but then there's also,
...."An eye for an eye" ...so like,.... it's giving you a permission... to take revenge,
..... or like in Muslim religions, ....when they... read the Koran,... it's like,.. there's no consistency in it,
.....every muslim ....interprets the Koran... in their own way,
.... and that's ....why they have like these religious wars, ...because somebody say,... somebody, ....one muslim might think..,
... this is telling me .....to go blow up a building.... For Allah ....and then they'll go and do it,
....you know, ....and it's ....when there's no consistency in something,... it's hard to make it,... you know, ..a foundation.

Daisy:


.... It's interesting you brought up that point, ....because I was going to... use the Koran as an example, too.
....The thing is if you don't.... read the Koran in Arabic,
.... because Arabic.... is such a subtle language, ...once it's translated into.... any other language,
.....it loses it's original meaning.... And urn,.... so therefore..., unless, ...it is read in Arabic,... it will be misinterpreted,
.....and that's ....why you have all those ...fundamentalist groups ....and the factions ...the different factions... in Islam,
.... at the moment... in a, ...you know,... all those countries.
.... So ....I tend to think.... that probably.... somewhere along the track.... that happened ...with the Bible, too.
.... It was originally written.... in a language ....that does not even exist anymore,
.... and then, ...it was,.... you know, ....translated into Latin ....and God knows ...how many different languages...

分拆文本
1、2册2.Religion and Philosophy 2A 开始到14分40秒的语音对应文本
                     
                      2. Religion and Philosophy

SIDE A

（原文修改文本）
Vivian:

O.K. Here we are again, gang. （uh）

Luke:

Hey!
Daisy:

Hey!
Bow:

What's up?

Vivian:

And, and I guess we're talking today about, ...maybe one step further after marriage,
may be religion ...and tie that together...with so me philosophy,
....uh..(mm).hey, gang,.... let's introduce each other..., Daisy?

Daisy:

O.K. This is Daisy here,... back at you, ....once again..... and(nah) this conversation ....we're having about religion ....and philosophy......
..... This is a deep one, ....over to you, Bow?

Bow:

Yes,.(Uh)... Hi, my name is Bow,.(uh)... studied architecture .....but philosophy is ....very interesting.... to me ...and(uh) I used to..(uh).. study about religions, too.

Luke:

This is Luke, ....urn, I don't know,.... I'm just really happy to be here,
.....I hope I can glean ....a lot of information from..(uh).., from(uh) my peers..... I'm always interested ....in finding new mentors ....and different ideas,
.....I, to fill,.... to fill my head,.... you know,.... I'm really looking forward to it, ....should be fun.

Vivian:

Hey, ...this is Vivian,.... I'm not that ...religious anymore
......, but I.... feel that..... there are certain things.... that I, .(uh)....seek... religion for,
....I used to be.... very religious..... and so this should be.... a very insightful .....conversation ...for me.

Daisy:

You know, ....what's quite fascinating, .(uh) ..here in Korea, ....
.....it's a common thing to ....ask people ....when you first meet them,
....."What is your religion?" ....But..(I).. in my country ....and I know .....also in your countries as well,
..... it's actually quite ....a personal question, ...right?

Vivian:

Definitely, .....yeah, you just couldn't go up to stranger ....and just ask....
..... "So ....are you Christian? ....Are you, .(why)...which church do you go to?"
.....I get that a lot of myself, .(mm)...and I, ....sometimes I,.(guess)... I guess the reason why, ...
.....this is rude is because ......you don't really want to ....expose yourself,
.....(Sure) and your beliefs.... to someone,..... especially someone ...you don't know.

Luke:

It's a very personal experience ...for everyone.(mm)..... I'm not offended ....by that question personally,
.....but it is a very personal ...thing.(mm)... to a real stranger.

Bow:

And I think,..(uh).. actually, ....in the States,.... if someone comes up to you... and asks like
..... "Are you a christian" ...or this and that, ...you kinda think.... that they're a Jesus freak.

Daisy:

Right.

Bow:

You know why, ....it's somebody ....that is really interested.... in religion ...
..(yeah)..and you're like, ....why are you asking me this,.(right).. you must be really weird.

Vivian:

And also, ...I guess,... people get very sensitive.... to questions like that,(mm)
.... obviously, ....because of our cultures, ....
.....it's not acceptable for ....someone to just go up... to someone
...."How old are you?,... Are you married? ..(mm) .How much do you make?,... What religion are you?"
.....And I guess religion, ...especially, ....for those who are religious, ....
.....it becomes a very sensitive topic,... it's a hot issue.
.... (Daisy: Right) ....Ah, ....which I guess brings us to.... an obvious question?
.... Are you religious, .(what)..what religion are you?

Bow:

Well,.... let's see, ....I went to (uh) a catholic school..... for fourteen years,
..... my parents.(uh).. are Irish catholic,.... and my grandparents, ....we used to go to church but,(uh)
..... once I got to college..... I didn't believe that ....catholicism was the, um,
,,,well, ....had everything that I,...(uh). thought it, ....should have,.... so kind of
....., now I like to learn about.... many religions, .
...because ...I think ....every religion.... has its good aspects ....and its bad aspects.

Vivian:

Could I ask ....what ....exactly ...was the turning point?
.... Why you thought... that really wasn't,...(mmm) you were fulfilling?

Bow:

....Um, that's a good question,.... I think, ...maybe because,... for example,
....in the catholic church, ...you're, ....they have like ...the Ten Commandments ....
....and if you break.... one of these commandments ....then you're not supposed to receive.... the body of Christ.
....Right? So,... but (I uh) like in my community, ....like I knew... these guys ....are like cheating ....on their wives
....which was breaking ...that commandment,.... but they would go up and receive communion
....and just ....because it looked good, ...and other people would think... that they don't sin,
....so it was just kinda like a social ....thing, ...more that a religious thing for them.

Vivian:

Right,... so it's not a serious.

Bow:

Right.(right)

Daisy:

.... Well, ...I was also raised in a very..,(uh).... generations in,... I don't know... how many generations,
... but it's been ....a long time, ...a very strict catholic family, ...
.....and my father.... has never missed... going to mass, ....one Sunday ...in his life, ...he's sixty- four years old.
..(haha) ....And urn,.... I also, as a child... I think about ...the age of fourteen
.... began to see that ....type of hypocrisy, ...in the church,
.... especially ....with the parish members ....and the one thing.... that really kind of turned my stomach is,
....I would watch them.... reciting.... the prayers.... that you have to recite ....during the mass,
....and they were just.... doing simply that, ....it's was kind of like... a parrot,
...you know, ....repeating everything ...you say, (mm)...they weren't.... thinking about ...the words,
.... they weren't thinking about.... what they were saying,
.... they were just saying them and... they do ....stuff like ....that on the weekend. ...You know bad things.(well)

Bow:

...Yeah,... Well, I think like,.... because, ....if they're christian or ....Catholic.... then they think that... by doing this,
....that saves them, ....they're gonna go into heaven, ...and they're..,
.....but the thing is for me, ....once I get older, ....I thought like, ....
....well, is the Bible really telling ....true stories? ....Is it really a heaven?..
.... When you start to learn.... about other religions, ....where.... the Buddhists think.... that you're kinda reincarnated ....and there's a cycle of life,(mm)
.... and who says that.... the Catholics are right? ....The Buddhists are wrong, ....or Buddhists are right ...and Catholics are wrong,
.... who actually knows? ....Nobody can really give an answer ....so, ....for these people... to just do that it's like.... making excuse ....and I'll just ....take my chances ....and it seems like... the best thing,
.... so I'm just.... gonna go to church, ...you know, ....even though they don't really ....believe any of the philosophies of the church, (mm)
....but by doing that then,.....they're saved, ...so to speak.

Vivian:

....Yeah, I agree..... I think it was ....the hypocrisy ....(uh)theory for me
...., I totally thought ....it was just a all..... Well, ....my mother is very, ....very religious and very,
....christian.... even till this day, ....and my sister ....and my mom do... not miss one Sunday,
....actually they're.... at church... five days a week almost,... and I ...was too, ....until I guess I was in about junior high?
.....And then ....after that.... I got to.... thinking... myself,.... "well,.... church is almost,
.... you know.... it's a thing.... that you are kinda forced... to attend,
..... and I thought ....I believed.... in the Bible ...and everything,...
.... but then... once you get a little older, ....and your mind... is more developed ...and you go to school
....., and you learn more things.... you come to realize....
...."well, for me ...I want scientific ....proof, ...a base to, ...you know,... formulate...., for example,
....is the Bible,.... are the stories.... in the bible true?.... Did Jesus ..
......you know, ....come to earth ...and were the disciples really there?
..... and then you have .....the science that says--.... actually ....man came from this and ...that in ..
......that's I guess, ...what sort of, ...kinda of weaned me... off of christianity.

Bow:

....Well, .(I)..I have this theory,.... if you think about ...how was religion invented or... thought up,
.... like(uh) the first.... humans stood erect, ....then a...... you know, ...once they had the capacity to think,
....(they) they had a capacity, ...we still do now,... if you talk about... in the scientific aspect,
.... we think ...in a linear.... way... from a to b, ....we always think in time... from a to b,
.... so, ....the first person ....who had the ability to... think... that way,... they went back... and said like,
...."I'm a person now in ...this time, ...how did I get here,... where did I come from?",
.... and because of that,.... lack of... brain power,... then religion was invented, because ... if there's a ...
....if you could think ....in kind of like a... z-access,.... or another dimension,
....maybe you could figure it out, ...but we can't, ...so.... religion was invented,
.... because of that reason, ...so that you wouldn't go crazy ...thinking about ...where did I ...come from,
....and the (uh)... physicist Stephen Hawking,.... he wrote this book.... "Brief History of Time"
.... and you know, ...usually scientists.... are... also, ....atheist,...
.... they don't believe ....in anything ....because they're always looking for facts.
.... And this guy, ...he went..... back ....and mathematically calculated ...the big bang,
.... the beginning of universe, .....but at the end of the book he says..
.... "and I... believe in god" ....because he can't go back... any further mathematically,
....because he only has a capacity.... to think from ....a to b in a linear sense.

Daisy:

....Right,... but also,.... basic,.... especially the christian religions,
...(um) and.., saying christian religions.... that can encompass anything from... Jehovah's Witnesses,
.... to the Seventh Day Adventists, ...catholic,... protestant, ...whatever.
....(um) If you, ....generally,... if the concept ...of those religions ....is correct,
.... if you are questioning,... urn, ...if the stories... in the Bible... are right, ...or if Jesus did exist,
.... then what you are... essentially doing,... is completely veering away.... from the essence of your religion,
.....because if it's.... based on the fact of faith, ....which asks you ...to believe... with no proof.
....So therefore....(um) if I'm to be, ...a part of those religions,...
.... but I have an intelligent... brain ....and I have questions ...to ask,
.... then.... therefore.... I'm not religious? .
....Because ....I question... my faith ....or I don't have faith ...because I question it?

Vivian:

....Well,.... my mother would skin my hide.... if I... were to say this.
..... And I voiced this to her ....and before I've gotten ...in really big trouble with her,
.... and I've said... this to other people, ....it's gotten me ...in sticky situations,... myself,
.... but... I'm at a very happy medium..... I've come to ....a good understanding .(uh)...of where I am.
.....I'm not religious ....enough to believe.... in all the stories... in the bible,
....and go to church,... thinking that.... I'm gonna... follow the preacher... and sing these song,
....but I tell you what,... when I go to church and... when I leave church,
....I leave with a good feeling, ...I feel renewed,... I feel like ....I wanna go out ...and do a good deed,
.... but that's not because ...I'm religious ....and I believe... in God.
.... I'm not saying ...I don't believe.. in God, ...but I'm saying,.
.... you do whatever.... that makes you feel good, ....and if it brings you.... to the point where
...."gosh, ...I wanna go out, ...and do a good deed today,.... I really... regret doing ....something,... yesterday,
..... and.... also the stories.... in the bible like.... I said.... I don't believe in them,
.... but they.... give me a nice, (um)...which foundation ...for morals or... what's not.

Daisy:

Right.

Bow:

....Well, I think urn,.... in every religion, ...like a,...(oo) some people choose... this only one,
... you know, ....religion catholic ...or whatever, ....but I think within all the religions,
....(there)  many things are the same,... they're just interpreted ....in different ways,
....so like, ....for example (like)....most religions have something to do ....with what we call in christianity,... the soul.
.... In Asia,.... they call... the spiritual energy ...or GI,....
.... and (uh) where that energy, ....that energy goes somewhere ...after it leaves your body, ...so....
there's different words for it, ...but,.... they're pretty much talking about ...the same thing.

Luke:

....Yeah, ....basically... organized religion.... at its best,... at its purist,....
..... is a community of people ....who kind of ....believe in the same... kind of idea,
.... but it's a way of.... bringing people together ...(and)....and agreeing on ...how to live ...just lives... and noble lives,
....and it sort of .....keeps people on a track,..(on an).. on an enlightened track, ..(and and)..and a track of ...benevolence ...and good will.

Vivian:

.....Shoot me ....for saying this ....but I,.... sometimes.... get to a point... where I kinda think ...those people especially, (um)
....having seen ....the Korean community going to church ....and where they're just...
...(a) really, really into it. ....They really religious ones, ....they sit there ....and cry ...and wail ...and anyway
....i just get to a point ...where I think,.... well they kinda ...rely on this church... and each other... and this religion... for (uh)...like,
.... it's kind of like a backbone... in their lives, ...or else they couldn't go on.

Daisy:

.... Well, ....for me... I... have a problem.... with the concept... of religion,.... basically, ...because of.... what I was saying before,
.... because it's supposed to be based, ...based on faith only... which....,(uh) in philosophy,
....they say that ....christianity is ....based on the theory ...that God is good, ....and God is good... because he is God,
....so ...therefore ...if I,... totally absorbed that... with faith,.... that theory,..
.... then I'm not.... given ....any allowance... to be human... and question ....why.... God is good.
.... If I wish.... to, ...um use the brain.... that God has... supposedly given me,
....then I should be able to analyze.... that and decide ...why God is good ....and why I should ..(uh)....worship God.
....So, ...in that case,.... I thinks religion just.... is anti-christian,
.... because ....it doesn't allow you ....to use your God-given talents.

Vivian:

.....Isn't that the reason..... why there's so many religions.... that have developed over ....a long time,
.... because.... you find some sort of discrepancy ....or something that.. you don't approve of,
....or can't come to terms with. .....So you turn to ...a similar religion,...
.... for example, ....you mentioned christianity,... christianity involves ...so many different religions.
....I didn't really... have (a)...a nice,.... understanding of.... it until I hit high school,
.... but before then like.... I said.... that I followed my mom to church thinking ....christians are christians,
....but... there's catholics,.... there's protestants, ...there's Presbyterians,... what is the difference?
....Little discrepancies.(mm)... in the Bible.(mm)

Bow:

....Yeah, that's, ....that's what I was gonna point out, ..
......It's like ...how can people make... this and why... is this religion christianity.... so widespread... in the world,
.....when their backbone.... as you call... is like ..
......based on the Bible ....which is just full of contradictions
.... (Daisy: Sure)... it's all, ....it's written by ....so many different writers... and like it's,
.... for example,... "love your brother, ....love yourself"(mm) ....but then there's also,
...."An eye for an eye" ...so like,.... it's giving you a permission... to take revenge,
..... or like in Muslim religions, ....when they... read the Koran,... it's like,.. there's no consistency in it,
.....every muslim ....interprets the Koran... in their own way,
.... and that's ....why they have like these religious wars, ...because ....somebody say,... somebody, ....one muslim might think..,
... this is telling me to go... blow up a building...(mm). For Allah ....and then they'll go and do it,
....you know, ....and it's .(right)...when there's no consistency in something,... it's hard to make it,... you know, ..a foundation.

Daisy:


.... It's interesting you brought up that point, ....because I was going to use the Koran as an example, too.
....The thing is.... if you don't.... read the Koran in Arabic,
.... because Arabic.... is such a subtle language, ...once it's translated into.... any other language,
.....it loses.... it's original meaning.... And urn,.... so therefore..., unless, ...it is read... in Arabic,... it will be misinterpreted,
.....and that's ....why you have all those ...fundamentalist groups .and.... the factions ...the different factions... in Islam,
.... at the moment... in a, ...you know,... all those countries.
.... So ..(I)..I tend to think.... that probably.... somewhere... along the track.... that happened ...with the Bible, too.
.... It was originally written.... in a language ....that does not even exist anymore,
.... and then, ...it was,.... you know, ....translated into Latin ....and God knows (mm)...how many different (mm)languages...

分拆文本：
2.第二册2.Religion and Philosophy 2A 的14分40秒到28分51秒A面结束的语音对应文本

Vivian:

And even, ....us speaking, ....of being able topartly speak several languages ...-- French,..
....Korean,... English,...what not, ....you know the difference ...and once you translate something
...., it loses a lot of the essence like, ...for example,... comedies that.... come enter a country,
.... that translated it loses all the humor, ....or whereas... if you've heard it,....in its original language
.... you would be..., you know...... (Daisy: Right, right / Luke: Appreciative).. exactly,
....and you know,.... I always to have to come back to the point ....where every topic tht'sbrought up I have to say,
....I have to go back to the scientific part of it,.... for example,... in the news they say,... oh we found another tablet.... that says that ....so and so was the actual writer,
....he was actually, ...there before ....such and such disciple...,we keep finding another tablet,
.... and another tablet, ...we have to keep criticizing..... I want proof, ...you know.

Luke:

But I think .....humans have to ultimately, ....except that.... they are fallible....
.... and there's this human.... inclination to ...want to know everything, ..
...but I just don't think ....there will ever become, ....will ever come a time.
.... When we can understand everything,... back to the Stephen Hawking thing,
.....there's just,.... there's just ....so much out there,.... that we can't comprehend, ......we can't get to,
....we can't reach, ....we can't fathom, ...and I think ....that's kind of ...what I would consider.... to be God,...
... is that,.... that place.... where the universe we keep,.... you break down an atom.... and you and you keep breaking it down, ....keep breaking it down.,
.....all sudden.... it's the entire universe. ...It all, it's sort of, ...it goes back into itself and...

Vivian:

Starts over again.

Bow:

I think that ....the human species.... will evolve.... into something that.., they say that..,
....scientifically ....we use thirteen... or fourteen percent of our,.... our ...(Vivian: Brains) ....brains,
... but I think that ....with evolution... if you look ...at evolution like... ...we went from.... little things,
little cells.... in the ocean, ...into,... like, ...walking creatures... and monkeys ...and you know,.. then standing erect,
... um,.... humans, ...homo sapiens. ....So if you look at like, ...the history of evolution,..
.... I think with, ......what's going on now, ...with like ....so much technology,... that people aren't ....really using their bodies... like they were before,
.... and like if you're living.... in the woods, ...you have to use your body to survive, ....but now people are using computers.... and remote controls and everything is...
.... like pretty soon.... they're gonna .....make voice-activated ah computers, ....everything's with your voice, ....so you're not gonna be.... using your body anymore.
.... And if you are not exercising then,... I think are.., ...the human race will kind of evolve.... into just brains ...and I think that, ...by that time,...
because of evolution ...that we will have a better understanding, ..
...I don't know ....how long it's gonna take..., who can say,... but I think,... you know, ...
during that time.... there's gonna be more.... and more religions.... and there's gonna be more,... you know, ...people are gonna come out ....that are smarter,...
.... you know, ...like Einstein making theories.... and it's gonna bring us into a...
....somewhere weird.... in the future, ...I think that,... we can't even fathom it right now.

Vivian:

Right.

Daisy:

I tend to ....disagree ....with that point,.... I think we're actually.... becoming stupider, ....
....because,.... urn, ...you know, ...hundreds ....and hundreds of years ago,... it's documented,
....especially ...in Asian history, ...the abilities,.... or even in the aboriginal culture ....it's documented ....that.... um...
....that natives ....have these abilities.... to communicate ....telepathically .....or they were able to... even appear
.... you know, ...in different places,... in history books... and things like that.
....And I think that,.... that was probably ....using your brain,... and I think that, ...we're not using our brain,
...we communicate... by telephone, ...or we do this,... we do that, ....if we're only looking ...at something scientifically ...and not spiritually,.... I'm not talking about ...religions
.... but also.... you know, ....also trying to develop to a point ....of encompassing other things... that people used to.... use,
.... like meditation ...or thought processes ...that we're losing an entire.... capability of our brains... that we once had,
...and I think ...that is essential to ....a person's spirituality, ...if you don't know... yourself ...and you know your abilities then,... you are not... an all- encompassing spiritual being.

Vivian:

I guess.... I agree... with both of you guys to... a certain point...., I do agree ...about the meditation coming to ...one ...with nature,
... you know,.... these days ah herbs and, ....you know, ....what is... scent candles.... and all this stuff is... becoming really big,
....but that's the kind of stuff they.... used a long time ago.... in Asia... and they are all the coming back to it,
.... but at the same time.... the other point, ....with the developing ....rather than.... going the opposite way,
...is also true as well, ....recently the ....break-through ...with D. N. A..... and are you know,
chromosomes.... and all that stuff, ....that's gotta lead to ...something else, too.

Luke:

But I think, ...when you say that,.... if that's your opinion ...then you're thinking ....in a micro-scale of just the earth,
.... I mean we don't.... even know... if there's other human, ...or any living beings
..., in other places, ...maybe they have religion, ...maybe they have something that,
....they could teach us ....or we could teach them, ....you just talk about the spirit ...and nature... that's just now.
...You know ...and I think,... actually, ...in a lot of religions too,... that's what they do, ...they have these two scales,
.... the macro... and the micro where,... the macro is they're... thinking of,
....you know, ...heaven and beyond ...and death ....and life all this stuff,
... but then down here,... they're thinking about ...going to church,
....you know,... it seems very simple.... when you think about ...it that way..., you know, ...we're just like doing this to get to here.

Daisy:

....But I do think that ....for us.... the only thing we're pretty ....much capable of controlling ....in our lives is the here and now,
....and I think, that,... urn,.... I don't believe ....that we should be going to church,... if obviously,...
.... like we used the example ....before in the catholic mass, ..
.....we'd see people going there ...and you know, ....cheating on their wives ...on the weekend,
....I mean,... that's just a ritual, ....and it's not something ....that is affecting them spiritually,
....obviously, ...but if, ...in the here and now, ....I can, ...by using my brain...., using my soul,...
.... for want of.... a better word,.... to improve myself both... physically, ...mentally, ...spiritually, ...
.....then I'm developing ...as a human.

Bow:
.
....I just wanna throw... this question out...., you don't have to answer,... if you don't want,
.....but.... what are your opinions ....on pre-destination?

Daisy:

Where we're gonna go?

Bow:

Like do you believe.... that yeah, ....do you believe that.... we are pre-destined.... or could do make your own future?

Daisy:

Um.

Vivian:

Does that also.... go along ...with the.., ....um.... being born again... and rebirth,.... and having past lives?

Bow:

Depends on you, ....if that's,... if that's what you think,... I'm just asking what ...like asking,
..... I'll give you my opinion ....right now..... I believe that we are .....pre- destined somehow and I,
.....like I said earlier I think ....I believe that because ....I can't figure out scientifically,
....so I just give in to the theory that, ...urn,... something we are here for a reason,... (Daisy: Right, right, you don't...)
....existentialism ...and all that crap,... but yeah I think, ...that how I believe,...
.... I think we are doing something here... for a purpose... and in a larger scale.

Vivian:

ls that on a personal basis that, ....you mean like the ...human race.

Bow:

I think,.... me and everybody, ...yeah..,.... I'm included... in the human race I hope.

Daisy:

....You know ....that movie.... "Sliding Doors?".... you know ...that's my theory ...on what happens,
.... I think that.... there is a big pattern right,.... and kind of like ...a pre- destined ...um,.... what's the word like,
.....you know, ....an itinary of what, ...you have to do... when you're alive, ....
but sometimes.... you just don't know,.... I thought that that... director's take on fate.... and pre-destination was quite... interesting.
....Because.... she had two choices... to make ....when she jumped.... on that train ...on the subway.
.....And it was what.... would've happened either way,... but she was pre-destined... to meet one man
...., and even though she took, ...a really long way... around, ...she still learnt things,
....so she took the other way, ....she took the route... form a to b,.... she still ...pretty much more... or l....ess ended up ...in the same spot .....and I think that the things....
.... that are meant... to happen to us ....whether they're good or bad,.... it doesn't matter ....what choices you make,....
.... I think your choices effect that ....but they will happen, .....where, you will end up,.... even if you take a detour,.... where you're supposed to be.

Vivian:

I really enjoyed that movie myself ....and that is a good point,.... because there's a, ....actually if you watch, ...a lot of movies..... I see like a majority ...of these movies... these days,
..... there's ....a pivotal point in your life, .....where you can make one choice... or the other,
.... there was the movie, ....recently,..... Nicolas Cage... urn...
..... (Daisy: Um,..... "Family Nan").... "Family Nan", ....even that movie... is similar to.... that in the sense that ....there's a pivotal point... in his life .....
.....where he could ....make this choice..... or that and that led to a stream of events.... that lead him to be,..,
....lead a single life,.... or to have, .....raise the family.... not have earned ...as much money ....but still be happy,
.... and ...you see a lot of movies.... that kind of bring.... that point about.

Daisy:

Right.

Luke:

Well, ....when you are pre-destiny,.... or pre-destined, ....does that mean.... you believe in free will, ....or that we are just fated,
....that everything is ....sort of programmed for us....
..... That's the thing.... I don't like about... the pre-destiny thing,.... is that for me.... the whole religious experience,.... is sort of a magical one, ....
....and that's the thing you see, ....the closest ...you come to God and..
...., is enlightened moments .....when you're appreciating nature ....or good art, ...or a good song
...... I think that's ....where the most intense ....religious experiences occur ....and I just think ....that creative impulse is part of ....what makes people kind of God-like... and having that,
.... having that spontaneity... and the creative urge...

Bow:

Yeah. ....I think so ....but I think it's beyond.... our capacity to think, ....I think that I believe.... that we have, ....our free will to make choices... in the future,
....... but... it's pre- determined,.... those choices ...that we make, ....it sounds kinda warped, ....but that's ...what I think...

Vivian:

Don't you think.... that pre-destination, .....that's not necessarily.... day to day ...every day of events.
.... Maybe, ....he's talking about.., ....coming to a point ....in your life, ....you,.... whether you take this,
....path a or path b....
.... I mean,..... you would probably end up, ....day to day ....events would probably be.... similar or different,
..... but you reach certain points in your life, ....for example,.... you find..,
....a mate that you would be happy with, ...you find,... that, ...you know,... you raise children, ...you get to certain points in your life.

Daisy:

....What if it's this,... what if it's that?.... we are at some point ....on another plane ...of awareness... before we become,
.... before we are born. ....Whether that be heaven... or whether that be,
...you know, ...the Buddhist ...belief in reincarnation,... that you chose this path,
....that you had something.... that you chose to do before you came here.
.....Then that would be ...definitely, ....it was pre-destined... for you.
....But I do believe.... that you have a choice ...whether we choose... before we're born ...or whether we choose ...when we get here,
....I don't think ....I would have been ....given conscience.... or I would have been given a brain ....if I wasn't meant to.... make any choices.

Luke: Yeah, ....that's very important too, ...to me.
....I think that.... aspect of religion is crucial to.... my understanding ....of spirituality ...and religion.

Bow:

....Here's something that.... I always noticed... in Catholicism.
....People wanna know about ...original sin... or sinning or mortal sin ...and all this stuff like,
....if you doing any of this stuff without getting forgiveness...., then you're gonna go to hell... and all this stuff,
....but then,.... the question ....that was always asked was... what happens if a baby dies....
.... before it is absolved of its original sin..... Where does it go and the crappy answer ...that the Catholic church gives us is limbo,
....and limbo to them,... is just, um.... (Daisy: Purgatory) ....purgatory.
.... It means like they can't answer, ....so they just say limbo. ...It's kind of an excuse they use,.... and I think that's .....why I became interested in knowing .....about other religions ...
....because if you believe, ....um what the Buddhists believe..... that there is a cycle of life ....and that a baby has life ....and it has energy,
.....then that energy is going.... into something ....whether it is the universe
..., or whatever turns the.., ....heats the sun or turns the earth or you know,
.... goes into a plant,..... but it goes somewhere..... It kinda answers that question you know a little bit better, ...so I'd like to know urn, ...your guys' opinion of that.

Daisy:

Well, you know...., that's interesting that you brought that up,... I always had a problem with that,....
... with the Catholic church as well,... that, this is a sin,.... and we tell you what's a sin so therefore it's a sin.
.... But unless you have an understanding ....or a conscience,... unless you sin ....you don't know... what is a sin.
..... Because if you're just.... reading something that says ok....
. "This is wrong" ....but you have no understanding... why it's wrong,.... therefore you can't be good.
....Uh, Herman Hesse said.... in "Narcissuss and Goldman"..... that the quickest way ...to a holy life is through a life of sin, ...actually I believe that,
.... because if you sin, ....and you do something wrong...., and you feel guilt ...and remorse for it,
....hence you are a good person...., you become a good person,... (Vivian: You redeem yourself)
.... right, but if you haven't..... if you have no understanding of what is, ...what is good or bad,... if you just go and do something,
....um and like you kill someone,.... but you feel no remorse for it,... you haven't,.... you haven't sinned,
.....you haven't sinned, ...because you feel no guilt, .....you feel no conscience about it.
...So sin is only, ....I believe you have to sin... to become good.

Luke:

It's a deep,.... a deeper understanding of.... what is right.... and what is wrong
...., (Daisy: Right) ....and it's an internalization of that.

Bow:

And see,.... that goes along with ...what buddhists think, ....it's just another reinterpretation of like a Chinese yin and yang,
.... urn, that's the same thing, ...good and bad,.... good and evil and black and white,...
.... the dark side of the mountain and light side of the mountain, ...good karma,... bad karma.
..... Every religion has a similar thing, ...it's all connected to me,....
..... I believe, ....it's just interpreted different. ....For example, ...monks..., um.... I haven't studied it that much
.....but I've read stories of monks,.... once they become enlightened,.... they can sin,... and what sinning is considered .....by christians... but they're still enlightened, ....so they're still gonna ....become a buddha, ...sooner or later.

Daisy:

Well sin.... must be... what enlightens one..,
you're not born, ....you're not enlightened ...until you've sinned, ...you have to sin... to be holy....
That's what I believe.

分拆文本：
2.第二册2.Religion and Philosophy 2A 的14分40秒到28分51秒A面结束的语音对应文本

(原文错误修改文本）
Vivian:

And even, ....us speaking, ..(uh)..of being able topartly speak (sai) several languages ...-- French,..
....Korean,... English,...what not, (mm)....you know the.... difference ...and... once you translate something
...., it loses(da)... a lot of the essence like, ...for example,... comedies that.... come enter a country,(thury)
.... that translated it loses all the humor, (mm)....or whereas... if you've heard it,....in its original language
.... you would be..., you know...... (Daisy: Right, right / Luke: Appreciative).. exactly,
....and you know,.... I always to.... have to come back to the point ....where every topic tht's (that's) brought up I have to say,
....I have to go back... to the scientific... part of it,..(mm).. for example,... in the news... they say,... oh we found another tablet..(that that).. that says that .(mm)...so and so was the actual writer,
....he was actually, ...there before ....such and... such disciple...,we keep finding another tablet,
.... and another tablet, .(and)..we have to... keep criticizing....(wo). I want ....proof, ...you know.

Luke:

But I think .....humans have to ultimately, ....except that.... they are fallible....
.... and ...there's this.... human.... inclination to want to know everything, ..(mm)
...but I just don't think ....there will ever become, ....will ever (ever) come a time.
.... When we (were)  can understand everything,... back to the Stephen Hawking thing,
.....there's just,.... there's just ....so much out there,.... that we can't comprehend, ......we can't get to,
....we can't... reach, ....we can't... fathom, ...and I think that's kind of ...what I would consider.... to be God,...
... is that,.... that place where ...the universe we keep,.... you break down an atom.... and you and you keep breaking it down, ....keep breaking it down.,
.....all sudden.... it's the entire universe. ...It all, it's sort of, ...it goes back into itself and...

Vivian:

Starts ...over again.(yeah)

Bow:

I think that ....the human species will evolve.... into something that.., they say that.., (uh)
....scientifically ....we use thirteen... or fourteen... percent of our,.... our ...(Vivian: Brains) ....brains,
... but (uh) I think that ....with evolution... if you look ...at evolution like..(uh). ...we went from...(uh). little... things,
little cells in... the ocean, into,... like, ...walking creatures... and monkeys ...and you know,.. then standing erect,
... um,.... humans, ...homo sapiens. ....So if you look at like, ...the history of evolution,..
.... I think with, ......what's going on now, ...with like ....so much technology,... that people aren't ....really using their bodies... like they were before,
.... and like if you're living.... in the woods, ...you have to ...use your body to survive, ....but now people are using computers.... and remote controls... and everything is...
.... like.... pretty soon.... they're gonna .....make voice-activated ....ah computers, ....everything's with your voice, ....so you're not gonna be.... using ...your body anymore.
.... And if you are not exercising then,... I think are..,(um) ...the human race ...(uh) ...will kind of evolve.... into just brains ...and ...I think that, ...by that time,...
....because of evolution that... we will have... a better understanding, ..
...I don't know ....how long it's gonna take..., who can say,... but.... I think,.(um).. you know, ...
....(and) during that time.... there's gonna be more and... more religions.... and there's gonna be more,... you know, ...people are gonna come out ....that are smarter,...
.... you know, ...like Einstein making theories.... and...(uh)  it's gonna bring us into a...
....somewhere weird.... in the future, ...I think that,... we can't even fathom it right now.(right)

Vivian:

Right.

Daisy:

I tend to .(the)...disagree ....with that point,.... I think we're actually.... becoming stupider, ....
....because,.... urn, ...you know, ...hundreds and hundreds ....of years ago,... it's documented,
....especially ...in Asian history, ...the..(uh). abilities,.... or even in the aboriginal culture ....it's documented ....that.... um......that natives ....have these abilities.... to communicate ....telepathically .....or they were... able to...(um)  even appear
.... you know, ...in different places,... in (a in) history books... and things like that.
....And I think that,.... that was probably ....using your brain,... and I think that, ...we're not using our brain,
...we communicate by... telephone, ...or we do this,... we do that, ....if we're only looking ...at something scientifically ...and not spiritually,.... I'm not talking about ...religions but
...also.... you know, ....also trying to develop to a point ....of encompassing other things... that people used to.... use,
.... like meditation ...or (uh) thought processes ...that... we're losing an entire.... capability of our brains... that we once had,
...and I think ...that is....(uh) essential to ....a person's spirituality, ...if you don't know... yourself and... you know your abilities then,... (you) you are not... an all- encompassing spiritual being.

Vivian:

I guess.... I agree... with both of you guys to... a certain point...., I do agree ...about the meditation coming to ...one ...with nature,
... you know,.... these days ah... herbs and, ....you know, ....what is... scent candles.... and all this stuff is... becoming really big,
....but... that's the(uh) kind of stuff they.... used a long time ago.... in Asia and they are all... the coming back to it,
.... but at the same time.... the other point, ....with the developing .(uh)...rather than.... going the opposite way,
...is also true as well, ....recently the ...(a) break-through ...with D. N. A and are... you know,
chromosomes.... and all that stuff, ..(that)...that's gotta lead to ...something else, too.

Luke:

But I ...( I) think, .(uh)..when you say that,.... if that's your opinion ...then you're thinking (uh)....in a micro-scale of just the earth,
.... I mean we don't.... even know... if there's other human,(uh) ...or any living beings
..., in other places, ...maybe they have religion, ...maybe they have something that,
....they could teach us ....or we could teach them, ....you just talk about... the spirit and nature... that's just now.
...You know ...and I think,.(um).. actually, .(that)( and)..in a lot of religions too,... that's what they do, ...they have these two scales,
.... the macro..(uh)... and the micro where,... the macro is they're... thinking of,
....you know, ...heaven and beyond .(and)..and death ....and life all this stuff,
... but then ..down here,... they're thinking about ...going to church, (mm)
....you know,... it seems very simple.... when you think about ...it that way..(right)., you know, ...we're just like doing this to get to here.

Daisy:

....But I do think that ....for... us.... the only thing we're pretty ....much capable of controlling ....in our lives... is the here and now,
....and I think, that,... urn,.... I don't believe that... we should... be going to church,... if obviously,...
.... like we used the example ....before ( like in)... in the catholic mass, ..
.....we'd see people going there ...and you know, ....cheating on their wives ...on the weekend,
....I mean,... that's just ...a ritual, ....and it's not something that... is affecting them spiritually, ....obviously,
...but if, ...in the here and now, ....I can, ...by... using my brain...., using my soul,...
.... for want of.... a better word,.... to... improve myself both... physically, ...mentally, ...spiritually, ...
.....then I'm developing ...as a human.

Bow:
.
....I just wanna throw... this question out..(mm)..,(uh) you don't have to answer,... if you don't want,
.....but.... what are your opinions on... pre-destination?

Daisy:

Where... we're gonna go?

Bow:

Like do you believe...(uh). that yeah, ....do you believe that.... we are(...uh) pre-destined or (mm)...could do make your own future?(mm)

Daisy:

Um.

Vivian:

Does that also.... go along ...with the.., ....um.... being born again...(the...) and rebirth,.... and having past lives?

Bow:

Depends on you, ....if that's,... if that's what you think,... I'm just asking what ...like asking,
..... I'll give you my opinion ....right now..... I believe that we are .....pre- destined somehow... and I,
.....like I said earlier I think ....I believe that because ....I can't figure out scientifically, (yeah)
....so I just give in to the theory that, ...urn,... something we (we) are here for a reason,... (Daisy: Right, right, you don't...)
....existentialism ...and all that crap,... but(uh)... yeah I think, ...that how I believe,...(yeah)
.... I think we are doing something here... for a purpose... and in a larger scale.(yeah)

Vivian:

ls that on a personal basis that, ....you mean like the ...human  (uh) race.

Bow:

I think,.... me and everybody, (mm)...yeah..,.... I'm included... in the human race I hope.

Daisy:

....You know ....that movie.... "Sliding Doors?"..(...no).. you know ...that's my theory ...on what happens,
.... I think that.... there is a big pattern right,.... and (uh) kind of like ...a pre- destined ...um,.... what's the word like, (cafic ...)
.....you know, ....an itinary of what, ...you have to do... when you're alive, ....
but sometimes.... you just don't know,.... I thought that that... director's take... on fate and... pre-destination was quite... interesting.
....Because.... she ...had two choices... to make ....when she jumped.on that ...train ...on the subway.
.....And it was what.... would've happened either way,.(  but).. but she was pre-destined... to meet one man
...., and even though she ...took, .(the)..a really long way.around, ...she still learnt things,
....so she took (the) the other way, ....she took the route... form a to b,.... she still ...pretty much more... or l....ess ended up ...in the same spot .....and I think that the things....
.... that are meant... to happen to us ....whether they're good or bad,.... it doesn't matter ....what choices you make,....
.... I think your choices effect that ....but... they will happen, .....where, you will end up,.... even if you take a detour,.... where you're supposed to be.

Vivian:

I really enjoyed that ...movie myself and... that is a good point,.... because there's a, ....actually(uh) if you watch, (um)...a lot of movies..... I see like a majority ...of these movies... these days,
..... there's ....a pivotal point in... your life, .....where you can make one choice.(mm).. or the other,
.... there was the movie, recently,(um)..... Nicolas Cage... urn...
..... (Daisy: Um,..... "Family Nan" (yeah)).... "Family Nan", ....even that movie..(yeah). is similar to.... that in the sense that ....there's a pivotal point... in his life .....
.....where he could make this choice..... or that(mm)... and that led to ....a stream of events.(mm)... that lead him to be,..,
....lead a single life,....(haha) or to have, .....raise the family.... not have earned ...as much money (aha)....but still be happy,
.... and ...you see a lot of movies.... that kind of bring.... that point about.

Daisy:

Right.

Luke:

Well, ....when you are pre-destiny,.... or pre-destined, ....does that mean.... you believe in...(in) free will, (or)....or that we are just fated,
....that everything is ....sort of programmed for us....
..... That's the thing.... I don't like about... the pre-destiny thing,.... is that for me.... the whole religious experience,.... is sort of ...a magical one, ....
..(and and)..and that's the thing you see, ....the closest ...you come to God and..
....,(is)  is enlightened moments .....when you're appreciating nature ....or good art, ...or a good song
...... I think that's ....where...(where) the most intense ....religious experiences occur ..(en..)..and I just think ....that creative impulse is part of ....what makes people kind of God-like...(and and) and having that,(mm)
.... having that spontaneity... and the creative urge...

Bow:

Yeah. ....I think so ....but I think it's beyond..(uh).. our capacity to think, ....I think that(why).. I believe.... that we have, ....our free will to make choices... in the future,
....... but... it's ...pre- determined,.... those choices ...that we make, ....it sounds kinda warped, ....but that's ...what I think...

Vivian:

Don't you think.... that pre-destination, .....that's not necessarily.... day to day ...every day of events.
.... Maybe, .(the)...he's talking about.., ....coming to a point ....in your life, ..(you)..you,.... whether you take this,
....path a or path b....
.... I mean,..... you would probably end up, .(and)...day to day ....events would probably be.... similar or different,
..... but you reach certain points... in your life, ....for example,.... you find.., (ha)
....a mate that you would be... happy with, ...you find,... that, ...you know,... you raise children, (mm)...you get to certain points in your life.

Daisy:

...(the)..What if it's this,... what if it's that?.... we are (uh...) at some point ...(uh).on another plane ...of awareness... before we become,... before we are born. ....Whether that be heaven..
... or whether that be, ...you know, ...the Buddhist ...belief in reincarnation,... that you chose ...this path,
....that you had something.... that you chose to do... before you came here.
.....Then that would be ...definitely, ....it was pre-destined... for you. (haha)
....But I do believe.... that you have a choice ....whether we choose... before we're born ...or whether we choose ...when we get here,
....I don't think ....I would have been ....given conscience.... or I ...would have been given a brain ....if I wasn't meant to.... make any choices.(haha)

Luke:

Yeah, ....that's very important too, ...to me.
....I think that.... aspect of ...religion is (  mm) crucial to my... understanding ....of spirituality ...and religion.

Bow:

....Here's something that (I)....(I) I always noticed... in Catholicism.
..(um)..People wanna know about ...original sin... or sinning or mortal sin ...and all this stuff like,
..(um)..if you doing any of this stuff without getting forgiveness..(mm).., then( you)  you're gonna go to hell.(uh).. and all this stuff,
....but then,.... the question ....that was always asked was... what happens... if a baby... dies....
.... before it is ...absolved of... its original sin....(mm). Where does it go and the crappy answer ...that the Catholic church gives us is limbo, (mm)
....(right) and limbo to them,... is just, um.... (Daisy: Purgatory) ....purgatory.
.... It means like... they can't answer, ..(mm)..so they just say limbo. (right)...It's kind of an excuse they use,..(right).. and I think that's .....why I became interested in knowing .(right)....about other religions ...
....because if you believe, ....um what the Buddhists believe..... that there is a cycle of life ....and that a baby has life ....and it has energy,
.....then that energy is going.... into something ....whether it is... the universe
..., or whatever turns the.., ....heats the sun or ....turns the earth or... you know,
.... goes into a plant,.(mm).... but it goes somewhere..(mm)... It kinda answers that question.(right).. you know a little bit better, .(mm)..so I'd like to know urn, ...your guys' opinion of that.(mm)

Daisy:

Well, you know...., that's interesting that... you brought... that up,... I always had a problem with that,....
... with the Catholic church as well,... that, this is a sin,.... and we tell you... what's a sin ...so therefore it's a sin.
.... But unless you have an understanding ....or a conscience,... unless you sin ....you don't know... what is a sin.
..... Because... if you're just.... reading something... that says ok.... "This is wrong"
....but you have no understanding... why it's wrong,.... therefore... you can't be good.
....Uh, Herman Hesse said.... in "Narcissuss and Goldman"..... that the quickest way ...to a holy life... is through a life of sin, ...actually... I believe that,
.... because if you... sin, ....and you do something wrong...., and you feel guilt ...and remorse for it,
....hence... you are a good person...., you become a good person,... (Vivian: You redeem yourself)
.... right, ...but if you haven't..... if you have no understanding of what is, ..(is).what is good or bad,... if you just go and do something,
....um ...and like you kill someone,.... but you feel... no remorse for it,... you haven't,.(you)... you haven't sinned,
.....you haven't sinned, ...because... you feel no guilt, .....you feel no conscience... about it.
...So sin is only, ..(I)..I believe you have to sin... to become good.

Luke:

It's a deep,.... a deeper understanding of.... what is right.... and what is wrong
...., (Daisy: Right) (and)....and it's an internalization of that. (right)

Bow:

And see,.... that goes along with what... buddhists think, .(uh)...it's just another reinterpretation of  (uh) like a Chinese yin and yang,
.... urn, that's the same thing, ...good and bad,....(good uh) good and evil and black and white,...
.... the dark side of the mountain... and light side of the mountain, ...good karma,... bad karma.
.....(ecery) Every religion has a similar thing, .(mm)..it's all connected to me,....
.....(I) I believe, ....it's just interpreted different. ....For example, ...monks..., um.... I haven't studied it ...that much
.....but I've ...read stories of monks,.... once they become enlightened,.... they can sin,.(and and) .. and what sinning is considered .....by christians... but they're still enlightened, ....so they're still gonna ....become a buddha, ...sooner or later.(mm)

Daisy:

Well sin.... must be... what enlightens one..,
you're not born, ...(you) you're not enlightened ...until you've sinned, ...you have to sin... to be holy....
That's ...what I believe.

多听一下中国的单口相声，大鼓书，简直和《听说大突破》如出一辙。
只有口语中汉语才，一边说一边用不同的类似的话来解释，英语实际的口语和我们平时说话是一样的，汉语说话也是颠三倒四的流利，听说大突破就是这个味道。

分拆文本：
3.第二册2.Religion and Philosophy 2B 28分51秒B面到43分的语音对应文本

二册2B

------
SIDE B
------

Bow:

Think about it this way, ....like ok, .....that those are ......in we know like..... from our society like in North America,
.....or Australia,.... in developed countries or Korea,.... like um, .....everybody's looking.... for a sense of community .....and they use the church that way.

Daisy:

.....But I do think that it,.... I mean,.... it has to become at some point, .....I mean...., it's great,.... if we can sit around...... and have a drink...... and share our thoughts ...on spirituality ...and we agree,
..... I don't see.... what the difference of us doing that ....and going,..... the concept of going to church on a Sunday as a community,
..... I don't see ....the difference in that..... As long as you are,.... and you brought up ....that concept m what is holy?
..... Well I believe that, ....that being holy .....is just being aware..... that you too ....are a spiritual being.
..... I believe that,.... the bible says ....that we're created ...in God's image, ....Buddhism says that... we're, ....we are part of the chain,
....the chain, ...we are all, ....and we are nothing.
.......It's all connected, ....and it's all in... who we are..... If we're aware ...that we are spiritual,.... we're just on a path of trying to be better .....and bettering ourselves... you are a holy person,
..... and I don't think.... it's up to any religion... to tell me.... that I'm not holy ....because ....I go and have IVF ....or because.... I choose not,.... I choose to take contraception.

Luke:

I really do hate that.... aspect of religion,..... the prosylitizing type of evangelical preachy kind of religion,
...... where it's where there's an effort......, the whole idea of the mission,.... going out and converting these people ....and making them,....
....... you know,.... understand ....and believe exactly the way ....you believe in things.
....Because I think ....ultimately.... it has to be a personal experience. ....Religion.... is such a subjective thing ....
.....and you can only,.... really, ....surround yourself with people.... who have generally the same ideas you have.
.... If you try to get to,.... to detailed in ....what you believe.... and what you don't believe
....., you come up with, ....with arguments.... and it is just a faith thing, ....it has to be left at that.

Vivian:

....Exactly,..... the reason .....why we have more and more.... divisions of each religion,
..... (Luke: Yes, they keep splintering) ....because,..
.. when you keep dissecting this, .....the reason why we can and can't, ....this is ....what we are supposed to do,
.....why we come up with more divisions?

Bow: ..
...
.....Well, I think that, .....yeah, this is all true, .....but religion is connected to community ....and people want a sense of community and to get that,
..... I think..., they go through religion.....
..... So, um,.... like you're talking about ....what is good... and I'm a good person,
.....but you're only a good person according to.... what your community thinks,.... other people around you.
....So this might be a bad example,.... but, like let's say, ....a guy, ...a human being, ...a baby that's raised by wolves.... like Tarzan,
.... it's kinda stupid..... Um...well I mean, .....if you think about it that way, .....he doesn't have ant connection to.... other people
.... (Daisy: Society) ....so then,.... maybe he will be purely holy,.... he's just acting on instinct,... just like,..... even though he's got a brain, ....like the wolves do.

Daisy:

....Good point, .....so therefore religion then,..... is based on society? .....Well, ....there's plenty of problems with society,
..... if we're gonna base it on that, .....religion can be ....a good thing, ....but it has to lead you back to yourself.
..... If you are not back to yourself to..... make your own decisions,.... with some type of, ....
....you know,.... a personal conscience..... if you're not understanding.... the reasons .....why this is a sin..... or the reasons .....why this is good and bad.
....Then I think.... that the whole concept..... then of religion would be anti-christian,
..... because you are.... not perpetuating christian values.

Vivian:

.... Don't you think..... that's the reason ....why religion has become impure,..... God ....and the church or ....the monastery ...or whatever,
..... is supposed to be pure .....and you're supposed to go there to release.... and to learn.
....But then, ....because of all these society, ...societal pressures ....that we receive...... the church is not as innocent .....and pure as it used to be
....., like I would like to think of church .....as "Little House on the Prairie', ....you go Sunday, ...you meet people .....you come there to..... not only socialize,
.....but to feel good .....and go back ....after a prayer.... thank you for.... our harvest and.... what not and please give us blessing.
..... Then you go and chop it up .....and then people ....want to dissect the religion and say,
..... well wait a minute, ....she got a pr...uh, .....she got an abortion, ....of she did this and that.
......And then you come up with ......all these issues ....and that's where church becomes so, ...
..... it's a hypocrisy..... After a while,.... you just want to,.... you know,..... why can't I just be the nice little picture,
....and go there for faith, ......and for moral reasons,...... and maybe support,.... (Luke: Support, yeah.), ....support,... exactly.

Luke:

....I grew up,..... I was raised on a commune actually,....... of families who were, ........
......whose ideology was based on a sort of a communality ....and belief in,.... belief in Jesus and stuff.
..... And um, ...it was yeah,.... it was done in the living room, ....you know,.... people would ... the families would come together
....., and they worship..... in the living room,.... just sit around the piano, ....and play songs and stuff,
....kind of the hippie vibe, .....it's kind of kind of cheesy now..... but it was really nice.
..... It was a nice way.... to learn about religion and stuff, ....and whatever beliefs I developed later,
..... that was a really nice thing,... and as time grew on,.... the families, .
.......they are, ....like the church itself grew .....and other families ....became involved..... and it grew and it ....became larger in size,
.....and then after a couple of years, .....the issue was raised of, of gender... in the church,
.... can't God be a man, ...and a woman,..... or does it just have to be a man.
....And it was, ...just,.... I don't know.... where it came from,.... but the question was raised,
.....and all of a sudden people.... had very strong opinions on this..... Just because it was raised,
...... everyone was getting along.... but when that came up, ......all of a sudden there was this huge division in the church ....
.....and so, ....suddenly,.... all my friends.... who'd grown up with.... in this commune and stuff,
.....who'd all moved out ....by that time of course, .....they were all going to,... to alternating sundays.
..... I couldn't meet my friends anymore, ....because the people .....who believed God was a man..... came on this Sunday,
.....and the people.... who thought God could be a man or a woman .....came on the other Sunday.
.....It totally changed everything.

Vivian:

.... Exactly, ....that's the hypocrisy of the church. ....I mean, ....the bigger it gets,..... and the more we try to
......(Daisy: Dissect it) ...you know, .....nit and pick at it and everything,.... the worse it gets. ....Isn't it nice?
..... If, you are just in a small little church,.... everyone's very friendly ....and good to each other, ....and there,.... to support each other.

Daisy:

.....But that would be saying that .....everybody has to believe ....what everybody believes everybody else thinks,
.....I don't think that, .....I think that's just human nature,.... that's gonna happen,....
..... but it becomes a big problem .....when it gets huge .....and organized,
.....and I think that's the problem.... if we keep it ...at a personal level, ....or small community thing,.... it'd be much better.

Bow:

....Yeah, ....and I have ....a good example ....of this of like community ....and church ....and like when Korean people.... immigrate to America,
..... the majority of them join a church, ....and the reason is because..... the people that have already gone there..... are connected to everything else,
..... that means setting up that person.... and they bring a little bit of money..... and they join the church,
..... that means ....that they just except ....all their beliefs ...or whatever, ....just for the reason that.... they can get set up in the community,
.... the church gives them loans...... They're real state agents, .....they tell them ....where to locate,
.....they tell them everything. ......And it kinda puts religion .......on the back-burner,..... or they just wanna live... a new life ....and they're not really caring about beliefs.
.....I talked to my, ....urn, ...uncle-in-law,..... my uncle and, ....he said,.... I said, ...."Why do you go to that catholic church?" ....He says,.... because..... after the service is finished.... we can drink beer ...and tell dirty jokes.

Vivian:

...Well, come on, .....that's the negative aspect of it, .....but ....O.K..... I go to visit my parents once in a while ......and my sister and my mom,
....and everybody...... goes to Korean methodist church.
.. .....And I went there to visit .....and we have literally three caucasians .....in the entire population of the church, ..
......who are like husbands of maybe Korean women......
..... But it's a church of maybe five hundred, ....six hundred, ...just Koreans .....and it's a small knit neighborhood,
..... almost...., their own little society. ....And I'd like to compare it to..... like Plymouth, .....
you know in 3amestown. Y
.....ou have, you're in the middle of this huge country,.... you don't know anyone, ....you can't speak the language.
.... I noticed that a majority of them couldn't speak the language.... but they all goes to this church,
.....yes they have prayer and they eat together a.....nd they listen to the service together ....but then afterward they have little classes for people who can't.
.....You know,... speak English, .....they'll have English classes, ....they'll have Korean classes ....for those don't.
....They,.... they take people shopping,..... they help them out ....in this community.

Bow:

.....I experienced this...... when I was a little kid ...in third grade. ....My best friend ...was a Korean.... and they used to go to like this church,
..... I think it was either Baptist or Methodist. .....And my family was Catholic,
....so .....my parents just thought that, ...."well, it's christian, ...so, you know, ...go with him one day';
.....he brought me to his church one Sunday.
.....And I, I got really scared because, .....they went to one of those classes, .....and they told me..... that I had to be ....saved right there,
.....that means that if I'm saved..... then I'm guaranteed of going to heaven,....
.... I was like well,..... you know,.... that was not like,.... let's not,.... you what catholicism told me,
....I got really scared,..... and I said well I'd better just do it just in case, y
....ou know like, ....you know, ....so I did, but I thought it was really freaky, ....and like they would play games .....with the bible like they'd call out,.... urn, ....a proverb or something .......and everyone would try to flip through it ....and find it first,
.....and I was like, ....what is going on here?..... This is bizarre, .....you know,..
..... so,... I think, ......they got their own little thing going on over there
.... (Luke: Uke a contest or something)..... yeah, ....but, ...you're right, .....in... you're coming from one country and going to another, ......
....it's very easily, .....it's easy to a... make that transition and they,.... that's they've set up church ....because to them there,
..... as far as the American society looks at Asians coming to America...... They're like, ......oh they're good people .....because they're christians .....and they have this church ....but they got a lot of other stuff going around?

Vivian:

O.K. alright. .....That's the reason church is there, .....it's supposed to support the community ....and help each other out,
..... give a lending hand,..... what about foreign churches..... that are here,... for foreign communities,
.....you go there .....and you're lost,.... hey,..... the church is gonna help you find residency,
......they're gonna help you find a,..... help you get around..... with transportation,
......you need help here..., there,.... you need help finding a job, .....we're gonna help you,
...... because that's .....what the community.... is supposed to be there for,.... isn't the church supposed to be the backbone of the community?
.....It's supposed to be there for you,..... when you need something, .....you can rely on them,
.... when there's a drought, .....when there's starvation, ....the church is supposed to ...give you a helping hand,..... that's ....why they're there.

Daisy:

....Actually, ....I thought that, .....was what the role of government... was supposed to do,
..... (Vivian:..... but the government doesn't fulfill.... that as much as it can, i...t should)
.... well, ...that's a problem, ....that's a problem .....if the American government isn't doing that.
...... In Australia we have a government... that's set up....., um I would consider.... to be fifty percent socialist,
......and fifty percent capitalist, .......so that people that ...don't have jobs,.... that don't have money... if there's a flood,
..... they're given money....... I have a problem,..... I have a problem with..... urn, .....the church doing ....too much for people,
.....and I really think that ....um if the church is playing .....such an integral role ...in society,
.....that it's playing the wrong role,.... especially because .....um you know.... if the past,...... the pastor or...... whatever he's called,
.....if he is taking money...... and he's taking money..... from these people and he,
....... and they .....find the church to be... so important. .....
......Then in christianity, .....it was Jesus Christ himself that walked in....... and told them to tear down the temple....... because it's not the church,..... it's not the temple that is most important thing.
.... It's your relationship ....with God.

Vivian:

.......O.K. and I agree with that,..... I don't think ....that you have to be physically... in the church ....to be religious,
.....I think you should, ....you don't have to go to church at all, ...it's my opinion,
..... but I'm saying..... church can have out-reach programs,..... they can have programs..... to help the community.... and its members.
..... If not, ....if they can't get involved in .....any of that, ....and it is only ....and strictly the role of the government ...or private agencies,
...... then what is the role of church. .....Is it so you can go in there,...... cause this is what I find,
.....so .....stupid literally.... about churches,.... is church there ....so you go can go on Sunday.... with your hymnal,
.....and your, ...you know,.... study materials,..... listen to the preacher .....and then..... listen to a bunch of songs ....and then go home, .....that's what it's there for?

Bow:

......Because people..... thought that they're... doing their duty.

Vivian:

....Yeah,.... exactly...., that,.... that's, ....what it becomes, ....it ends up being a dutiful thing
..... (Daisy: right) ....and it becomes, .....Sunday morning we wake up, ....get pretty, ....go to church,
.....listen to the minister, .....sing songs and then go home. ...(Daisy: Yeah) .....That's not what church is supposed to be,
..... they're there to support you,..... that is all a morale thing doing the,
..... you know,.... going to church.... and singing ....and listening to... ...that's a morale thing,
.......after church,...... then people can, ......one on one, .....not with the minister, ....but it can be the person sitting .....next you
........"hey,.... are you're having problem?, ....do you need someone to talk to?",
.... Help thy neighbor,.... this...., this kinda stuff is in the,... in the bible, .....it's supposed to be there for support,
.....and I think that the stories,.... my personal opinion is, .....I think that those stories .....in the bible are examples... for you to,
..... to, you know, ...get fulfillment out of... ..maybe, .....a foundation or you know.... for you to maybe get some morals out of,.....
...... like you listen to -- there's a story of well.., ....she's a bad woman.... but they were all criticizing her, .....and God comes and helps her,
..... hey, ....they're not saying.... do the same thing. ....They're saying help someone that is,
..... you know, ....that everyone else is maybe ....not so nice to.

Daisy:

... Right.... I think that, ....that is all good if the church is..... helping poor people..... and also for people helping
..... you know, ....the needy.... (Vivian: sure, ...why not?).... or the people ....that need support in settling in a country ...or whatever.
.....But I'm saying that..... the church should never become..... the focus ....of why they're joining the church itself.

Vivian:

Exactly, ....it's why that, ......there's so much corruption..... in churches especially...... what the past ten years,
.....you know,.... in America, ....there's big scandals. .
.......Because they're getting money,...... they're using this money..... they're not actually as religious as they seem,
.....it's when the churches .....become too big and corrupt.
.... You wanna keep them small-scale...... so that they are really supporting.... the community.

Daisy:

Right.

Vivian:

How about this,.... how about we skip to another topic, ....since we got ....so depth on this..
.... How do you feel about ....going to heaven.... and going to hell, ....uh, does anybody have any opinions on that?

分拆文本：
3.第二册2.Religion and Philosophy 2B 28分51秒B面到43分的语音对应文本

二册2B

------
SIDE B
------


(原文错误修改）


Bow:

(mm) Think about it this way, ....like ok, .....that those are ......in we know like..... from our society like in North America,
.....or Australia,.... in developed countries... or Korea,.... like um, .....everybody's looking for... a sense of community .....and they use the church ...that way.（mm）

Daisy:

.....But I do think that it,.... I mean,.... it has to become... at some point, .....I mean...., it's great,if ...we can sit around and... have a drink and share.... our thoughts ...on spirituality ...and we agree,
..... I don't see.... what the difference of ...us doing that ....and going,..... the concept of.... going to church ....on a Sunday as a community,
..... I don't see ....the difference in that..... As long as you are,...(uh). and you brought up ....that concept m what is holy?
..... Well I believe that, ....that being holy .....is just being aware..... that you too ....are a spiritual being.
..... I believe that,.... the bible says ....that we're created in... God's image, ....Buddhism says that... we're, ....we are part of the chain,
....the chain, ...we are all, ....and we are nothing.
.......It's all connected, ....and it's all in... who we are..... If we're aware that... we are spiritual,.... we're just on a path of trying to be better and.... bettering ourselves... you are a holy person,
..... and I don't think.... it's up to any religion... to tell me that ...I'm not holy ....because ....I go and have IVF ....or because.... I....(I) choose not,....(I) I choose to ...take contraception.

Luke:

I really do hate that.... aspect of religion,..... the prosylitizing type of...(e e). evangelical preachy kind of... religion,
...... where it's where there's an effort......, the whole idea of the mission,.... going out and ...converting these people ..(and) ..and making them,....
....... you know,.... understand ...(and) .and believe exactly the way ....you believe in things.
....Because I think ....ultimately.... it has to be.... a personal experience. ....Religion (is).... is such a subjective thing ....
.....and you can only,.... really, ....surround yourself with people.... who have generally ...the same ideas you have.
.... If you try to get to,.... to detailed in ....what you believe.... and what you don't believe  (right)
....., you come up with, .with arguments...(sur).... and it is just a faith thing, ....it has to be left at that.

Vivian:

....Exactly,..... the reason .....why we have more and more.... divisions of each religion,
..... (Luke: Yes,  )....because,.(.they keep splintering)
.. when you keep dissecting this, .....the reason why we can and.... can't, ....this is ....what we are supposed to do,
.....why we come up with more divisions?

Bow: ..
...
.....Well, I think that, .....yeah,.... this is all true, .....but ....religion is connected to community ....and people want a sense of community ....and to get that,.... I think..., they go... through religion.....
..... So, um,.... like you're talking about ....what is good... and I'm a good person,
.....but you're only... a good person.... according to.... what your community thinks,.... other people around you.
....So this might be a bad example,.... but,.... like let's say, ....a guy, ...a human being, ...a baby that's... raised by wolves...(mm). like Tarzan,(mm)
.... it's kinda stupid..... Um...well I mean, .....if you think about it that way, ..(mm)...he doesn't have ant connection to.... other people
.... (Daisy: Society) ....so then,.... maybe he will be purely holy,.... he's just acting on instinct,... just like,..... even though he's got a brain, ..(right)..like the wolves do.

Daisy:

....Good point, .....so therefore religion then,..... is based on society? .....Well, ....there's plenty of problems with society,
..... if we're gonna base it on that, .....religion can be ....a good thing, ....but it has to ...lead you back to yourself.
..... If you are not back to yourself to..... make your own decisions,.... with some type of, ....
....you know,.... a personal conscience..... if you're not understanding.... the reasons .....why this is a sin..... or the reasons .....why this is good and bad.
....Then I think.... that the whole concept..... then of religion ....would be anti-christian,
..... because you are not..(um). perpetuating christian values.(haha)

Vivian:

.... Don't you think..... that's the reason ....why religion has become impure,..... God ....and the church or ....the monastery ...or whatever,
..... is supposed to be pure .....and you're supposed ...to go there.... to release.... and to learn.
....But then, ....because of all ...these society, ...societal pressures ....that we receive...... the church is not as innocent .....and pure as it used to be
....., like ....I would like to.... think of church as ..."Little House on the Prairie', ....you go Sunday, ...you meet people .....you come there to..... not only socialize,
.....but to feel good .....and go back ....after a prayer.... thank you for.... our harvest and.... what not ...and please give us blessing.
..... Then you go and chop it up and ....then people ....want to dissect the religion and say,
..... well wait a minute, ....she got a pr...uh, .....she got an abortion, ....of she did this and that.
......And then you.... come up with ......all these issues and ...that's where ....church becomes so, ...(oh)
..... it's a hypocrisy...(yeah).. After a while,.... you just want to,...(mm). you know,..... why can't I just be the nice little picture, (mm)
....and go there for faith, ......and for moral  (uh) reasons,.(uh)..... and maybe support,.... (Luke: Support, yeah.), ....support,... exactly.

Luke:

....I grew up,..... I was raised on a ...(on a) commune actually,....... of families who were, ........
......whose ideology was based on a sort of.... a communality ....and belief in,....(belief in ) .... belief in Jesus and stuff.
..... And um, ...it was yeah,.... it was done in the living room, ....you know,.... people would ... the families would come together
....., and they worship..... in the living room,.... just sit around the piano, ....and play songs and stuff,
....kind of the hippie vibe, .....it's kind of kind of cheesy now..... but it was really nice.
..... It was a nice way.(that)... to learn about ...religion and stuff, (mm)....and whatever beliefs I developed later,
..... that was a really nice thing,... and (as)... as time grew on,.... the families, .
.......they are, ....like the church itself grew .....and other families .(um)...became involved..... and it grew and it ....became larger in size,
.....and then after a couple of years, .....the issue was raised of,... of (uh)gender... in the church,
.... can't God be.... a man, ...and a woman,..(mm)... or does it just have to be a man. (mm)
....And.... it was, ...just,.... I don't know.... where it came from,.... but the question was raised,
.....and all of a sudden people.... had very ... strong opinions on this.(mm).... Just because it was raised,
...... everyone was getting along.... but when that came up, ......all of a sudden there was this huge division in the church ....
.....and so, ....suddenly,.... all my friends.... who'd grown up with.... in this commune and stuff,
.....who'd all moved out ....by that time... of course, .....they were all going to,... to alternating sundays.(mm)
..... I couldn't .....( I couln't) meet my friends anymore, .(uh)  (becuse)...because the people .....who believed God was a man..... came on this Sunday, (mm)
.....and the people.... who thought God (  sould) could be a man or a woman (mm).....came on the other Sunday.
.....It totally changed everything.

Vivian:

.... Exactly, ....that's the hypocrisy of the church. ....I mean, ....the bigger it gets,..... and the more we try to
......(Daisy: Dissect it) ...you know, .....nit and pick at it and everything,.... the worse it gets. ....Isn't it nice?
..... If, you are just in a small little church,.... everyone's very friendly ....and good to each other, ....and there,.... to support each other.

Daisy:

.....But that ....would be saying that .....everybody has to believe ....what everybody believes ...everybody else thinks,
.....I don't think that, .....I think that's just human nature,.... that's gonna happen,....
..... but it becomes a big problem .....when it gets.... huge .....and(and) organized, (yeah)
.....and I think that's the problem.... if we keep it ...at a personal level, ....or small community thing,.... it'd be much better.

Bow:

....Yeah, ....and I have ....a good example ....of this of like community ....and church and... like when Korean people.... immigrate to America,(haha)
..... the majority of them..... join a church, ....and the reason is.... because..... the people that have already gone there..... are connected ....to everything else,
..... that means.... setting up that person.... and they bring a little bit of money..... and they join the church,(mm)
..... that means ....that they just except ....all their beliefs ...or whatever, ....just for the reason that.... they can ...get set up in.... the community,
.... the church gives them loans...... They're real state agents, .....they tell them ....where to locate,
.....they tell them everything. ..(mm)....And.... it kinda puts religion .......on the back-burner,..... or they just wanna live..(yeah).... a new life ....and they're not really caring about beliefs.
.....I talked to my, ....urn, ...uncle-in-law,..... my uncle and, ....he said,.... I said, ...."Why do you go to ...that catholic church?" ....He says,.... because..... after the service is finished.... we can drink beer ...and tell dirty jokes.(hahaha...)

Vivian:

...Well, come on, ..(ey)...that's the negative aspect of it, .....but ....O.K..... I go to visit ....my parents once in a while ......and my sister and my mom,
....and everybody...... goes to(uh)... Korean methodist church.
.. .....And I went there to visit and ...we have... literally.... three caucasians .....in the entire ....population of the church, ..
......who are like husbands of... maybe Korean women......
..... But it's ...(it's) a church of maybe five hundred, ....six hundred, ...just Koreans .....and it's a small knit neighborhood,
..... almost...., their own little society. ....And I'd like to compare it to..... like Plymouth, .....
you know in James  town.
...You have, ....you're in the middle of... this huge country,.... you don't know anyone, ....you can't speak the language.
.... I noticed that a majority of them ....couldn't speak the language.... but they all goes to this church,
.....yes they have prayer and..... they eat together and they.... listen to the service together ....but then afterward .....they have little classes.... for people ....who can't.
.....You know,... speak English, .....they'll have English classes, ....they'll have Korean classes ....for those don't.
....They,..(is).. they take people shopping,..... they help them out ....in this community.

Bow:

.....I experienced this...... when I was a little kid ...in third grade. ....My best friend ...was a Korean.... and they used to go to.. like this church,(mm)
..... I think it was either Baptist ....or Methodist. .....And my family was Catholic,
....so .....my parents just thought that, ...."well, it's christian, ...so, ....you know, ...go with him one day';
.....he brought me to.... his church one Sunday.
.....And I,.... I got really scared.... because, .....they went to one of those classes, .....and they told me..... that I had to be ....saved..... right there,
.....that means that ....if I'm saved..... then I'm (uh)... guaranteed of going to heaven,....
.... I was like well,..... you know,.... that was not like,.... let's not,.... you what catholicism told me,
....I got really scared,..... and I said well ....I'd better just do it just in case,
...you know like, ....you know, ....so I did, ....but I thought it was really freaky, ....and like they would play games .....with the bible like they'd call out,.... urn, ....a proverb or something and ....everyone would try to flip through it ....and find it first, (right)
.....and I was like, ....what is going on here?..... This is bizarre, (mm).....you know,..
..... so,... I think, ......they got their... own little thing going on over there
.... (Luke: Uke a contest or something)..... yeah, ....but, .(right)..you're right, .....in.(the).. you're coming... from one country and going to another, ......
....it's very easily, .....it's easy to a..(um)..... make that transition and they,.... that's they've set up church ....because ....to them there,
..... as far as the ....American society.... looks at ...Asians coming to America...... They're like, ......oh they're good people .....because they're christians .....and they have this church ....but they got a lot of other stuff... going around?

Vivian:

O.K.... alright. .....That's the reason church is there, .....it's supposed to support the community ....and help each other out,
..... give a lending hand,..... what about.... foreign churches..... that are here,(um)... for foreign communities,
.....you go there .....and you're lost,.... hey,..... the church is gonna help you find ...residency,
......they're gonna help you.... find a,..(uh)... help you get around..... with transportation,
.....(uh) you need help here..., there,.... you need help finding a job, .....we're gonna help you,
...... because ....that's .....what the community.... is supposed to be there for,.... isn't the church supposed... to be the backbone of the community?
.....It's supposed to be there for you,..... when you need something, .....you can rely ..on them,
.... when there's a drought, .....when there's.... starvation, ....the church is supposed to ...give you a helping hand,..... that's ....why they're there.(mm)

Daisy:

....Actually, ....I thought... that, .....was what the role... of government... was supposed to do,
..... (Vivian:..... but the government doesn't .....fulfill that as much as it can, ....it should)
.... well, ...that's a problem, ....that's a problem .....if the American government... isn't doing that.
...... In Australia we have a government... that's set up....., um ....(that would I) I would consider.... to be fifty percent socialist,
......and fifty percent capitalist, .......so that people that ...don't have jobs,.... that don't have money... if there's a flood,
..... they're ...(they're) given money....... I have a problem,..... I have a problem with..... urn, .....the church doing ....too much for people,
.....and I really think that ....um ...if the church is playing .....such an... integral role ...in society,
.....that it's playing the wrong role,.... especially... because .....um ....you know.... if the past,...... the pastor or...... whatever he's called,
.....if he is taking money...... and he's taking money..... from these people and he,
.......(um) and they .....find the church to be... so important. .....
......Then... in christianity, .....it was Jesus Christ himself.... that walked in....... and told them to tear down the temple....... because it's not the church,..... it's not the temple.... that is most important thing.
.... It's your relationship ....with God.

Vivian:

.......O.K. ....and ....I (I) agree with that,..... I don't think ....that you have to be physically... in the church ....to be religious,
.....I think you should, ....you don't.... have to go to church.... at all, ...it's my opinion,
..... but I'm saying..... church.... can have .....out-reach programs,..... they can have ....programs..... to help the community.... and its members.
....(no, then).... If not, ....if they can't get involved in .....any of that, ....and it is only ....and strictly the role of the government ...or private agencies,
...... then what is the role of church. .....Is it so you can go in there,...... cause this is ...what I find,
.....so .....stupid literally.... about churches,.... is church there ....so you go can go.... on Sunday.... with your hymnal,
.....and your, ..(um)....you know,.... study materials,..... listen to... the preacher .....and then...(why).. listen to a bunch of songs ....and then go home, .....that's what it's there for?

Bow:

......Because people..... thought that they're... doing their duty.

Vivian:

....Yeah,.... exactly...., that,.... that's, ....what it becomes, ....it ends up being ...a dutiful thing
..... (Daisy: right) ..(is)..and it becomes, .....Sunday morning we wake up, ....get pretty, ....go to church,
.....listen to the minister, .....sing songs and... then go home. ...(Daisy: Yeah) .....That's not what church is supposed to be,
..... they're there to support you,..... that is all.... a morale thing.... doing the,
..... you know,.... going to church.... and singing and... listening to... ...that's a morale thing,
.......after church,...... then people can, ......one on one, not... with the minister, ....but it can be the person sitting .....next you
........"hey,.... are you're having problem?, ....do you need ....someone to talk to?",
.... Help thy neighbor,.... this...., this kinda stuff is in the,... in(uh)... the bible, .....it's supposed to be there for support,
.....and I..... think that ....the stories,.... my personal opinion is, .....I think.... that those stories .....in the bible ...are examples... for you to,
..... to, ....you know, ...get fulfillment out of... ..maybe, .....a foundation or..... you know.... for you to ....maybe get some morals out of,.....
...... like you listen to -- there's a story of well.., ....she's a bad woman.... but they were all criticizing her, (mm).....and God comes and helps her,(mm)
..... hey, ....they're not saying...(mm). do the same thing. .(mm)...They're saying help someone that is,
..... you know, ....that everyone else is maybe ...(right right)....not so nice to.

Daisy:

... Right.... I think that, ....that is all good if the church is..... helping poor people..... and also for people helping
..... you know, ....the needy.... (Vivian: sure, ...why not?)....(or) or the people ....that need support in ...settling in a country ...or whatever.
.....But I'm ...( I'm) saying that..... the church should never become..... the focus ....of why they're joining the church itself.

Vivian:

Exactly, ....it's( it's) why that, ......there's so much corruption..... in churches especially...... what the past ten years,
.....you know,.... in America, ....there's big scandals. .
.......Because... they're getting money,...... they're using this money....(uh)  they're not actually ....as religious as they seem,
.....it's when ...the churches .....become too big and corrupt.(mm)
.... You wanna keep them ....small-scale..(mm).... so that they are really supporting.... the community.(right)

Daisy:

Right.

Vivian:

How about this,.... how about we skip to another topic, ....since we got ....so depth on this..
.... How do you feel about ....going to heaven and ....going to hell, ....uh, ....does anybody... have any opinions on that?

分拆文本：
4.第二册2.Religion and Philosophy 2B 43分到57分53秒B面结束的语音对应文本


Bow:

Yeah, I used to think that that's all there was,.... there was a heaven and a hell, ....but now I don't think about it,
.....because I think ....there's just like I said earlier,.... there's interpretations of heaven and hell
...., to the Buddhists, ...you know, ...it's like being recycled, t
.o, ....you know, ....urn, to me,.... it doesn't really matter what you call it,... it's just,... eventually,....... we're gonna go somewhere ....and we'll find out then,
..... you know,.... so, I mean...., I think it's like a fear tactic, ....especially for the catholic church to say..... like hell and describe it so vividly,
.....you know to say that, ....who wants to go there for eternity?,.... you know,....... of course you're not gonna not people, ....and you know.

Vivian:

.....And they,..... and they make it a point to teach it to ....you ....while you're really little, ....and then it's in your head. O
.....nce you're an adult, ....if someone were to say .....there's this place called hell .....and you're gonna die ....and if you go there, ...it's really bad.

Bow:

.....Well, here's another thing..... speaking about death,.... um now what do you, .....what do you believe is more scary, .....like I think actually. .....I was afraid of like.... when they would tell me..... well you go to heaven, ....and you just live forever, ....and I was like, ....I can't think of living forever.... (Daisy: sure,)
....that's bizarre to me..... or another thing that.... would be bizarre is the other way,..... the opposite way is, ....everything just turns black,..... and that's scary too, ......you know, ...so...

Daisy:

Nothingness.

Vivian:

And what about reincarnation too, I mean...

Bow:

That's my way out..... Once I found out about that, ...I'm like..,.. cool.... I'll just come back again.

Luke:

I'm a duck.

Vivian:

You, you live a different life...., right. A flower,... a tree.., ...a duck.

Bow:

....You're putting it down,.... but you've never been a flower, .....you haven't been a duck.

Vivian:

.....No, I think that's better than,..... it's better than living one life forever.

Daisy:

Sure,..... I think that most of those things in ....christianity were probably,..... you know,.... made up, .....to control people,
.....you know, .....I think the Catholic church is ......and the christian church the England as well........ has used those tactics in ......many ways to control ....things like,
....even population..... (Bow: and it's worked) .....you know,.... the church of England said it's ok,...... to take contraception .....when the Catholic church didn't.
..... I think there's a lot of..... historical background .....I think in those concepts,.... but um, .....yeah, ....
....I don't know, ...I think, .....I'd like to go with... the reincarnation thing. ...But then if you get to utopia, ....where are we going ...after that?

Bow:

......Well, that's the thing... I was talking about before.

Daisy:

...Nirvana, ...nirvana,... that's it.

Luke:

The collective consciousness whatever,..... that one is supported by,...... by,....... science actually to a degree .......and the Nitrogen cycle and everything,
....... how you're composed..,..... decomposing body ......will fertilize the trees around it, ...........matter cannot be created.... or destroyed.
..... It's just,.... you know,.... it just changes form, .....just takes different shapes, ....so if you figure, ......whatever it is that.... makes up..... who you are right now your consciousness,.... your physical ......and your spiritual self.
.....If you think of that energy,..... the GI,..... or the soul or whatever, ....going just, ......taking a different form. ....It's comforting..... I'm cool to that.

Vivian:

So,..... I'll have we all come to....... a consensus ....to become Buddhist monks...... and reincarnate ourselves?

Luke:

No.

Daisy:

No, but my question..... would be then, .......after you've done ....that complete cycle,..... if reincarnation is the deal,.... right...
........ If you've completed your cycle, ......you've lived five hundred a thousand lives
....... How many lives you ......are supposed to live..... and you got to the point .......of complete enlightenment .....that Buddha was able to come to,..... then, ....what's nirvana?

Bow:

...... I don't know, .....it's a band ....from Seattle.

Daisy:

......What happens .....after that, .....where do you go?

Bow:

......Well, that's the thing again,....... like what I was saying,...... we only have the capacity to think linear, .....where do you go?..... Where did we come from?.... We only go in a line.

Daisy:

......Well, that's exactly...... the thing that's the deal. ......You have to reach it .....to be able to compare yourself until you realize...... what that is supposed to be,
...... I mean we have to go..... and experience it ourselves,... I guess.

Daisy:

I guess that ......answers it's own question....... If you are completely enlightened .....then you'd know .....what nirvana was.

Luke:

.....And I think...... that any description of .....what it could be..... would be limited by language.
......I think something .....that's so holy .....and so such this great thing, .....well, I mean, ....what could it possibly be, .....you couldn't comprehend it.
......Because you could experience it ....but it's like,.... you know, ....writing about .....art or something, it's like...... you're limited by language,....... you can't.... put it into words, ....it's just a purely ...

Vivian:

Well, I mean if you put it that way,...... no,..... I hate to go... often into this topic,.... but, ....take sex..... I mean, ....you don't know .....it until you do it,
..... and then you don't know...... what's it like to feel like, .....until you've felt a certain, ...you know,... OK,... degree of it.

Bow:

Religion of Sex.

Vivian:

...It's like people say "hey,...... this tastes like this .....and this and this, ........if you've never tasted it ....before, ....no matter...... how much someone ....can describe it.......to....you,...... you're not gonna know.

Luke:

That's very tentative.

Daisy:

O.K., then,..... we get to nirvana..... or you're gonna come back ....as something else, .......what would you like to ....come back as?

Luke:

I don't think,.... I don't think of if in terms of this life's over,.... I'm gonna start a different life, ....or I'm a goat ..or whatever.

Luke:

I guess it's changes.... I guess ....if I could choose something, ....yeah,.... a goat would be pretty cool.

Daisy:

A goat, ....(Yeah) ...what about you?

Bow:

.....I don't know, ....a goat, ....too, .....but here's a thing.... that I find the discrepancy in .....that reincarnation is,
......if that's the way it goes..... How come we don't, ....except for like these Buddhist monks... who are enlightened,... remember any of this, ....what's the purpose of not remembering
....., why are we just reincarnated ...a hundred million times, ....but we can't use any of that experience.

Daisy:


Maybe it's like, .....um .....I guess it's just like, ....if you pass go, .....you don't get two hundred dollars ....if you know ...what I mean,
..... like you live one life, ....and then basically, .....you stuffed that one up,..... you made a lot mistakes. ....So,.... what you get is.... just an another chance.

Bow:

But you don't know about it.

Daisy:

You don't get the two hundred bucks.....you know, ...when you pass go?

Bow:

.....And then it's comes back to ...a scientific thing,.... or just you know, ...like my friend said,
..... "Matter can't be created.... or destroyed';... right?.... So like just the energy...... is moving into something else,
.....the energy doesn't have, ...actually, ...a sense of being, ...but it bes...

Vivian:

I mean if you could remember ......all those experiences ........and then...... that way you can make ....better choice... in the next life, .....then we would all be at ....a point of nirvana ....and enlightenment. .....There would be no point in living life, ...in a sense,... right?

Bow:

Not necessarily, .....because they say.... people with bad karma turn out to be bad things, .....and it just keeps going over and over again,... until you break the cycle.

Vivian:

So what happened to me?

Bow:

Maybe.

Daisy:

Because, because,.... that's what I think, ....the key to religions,... you have to or spirituality, ....
......you have to at some point.... make that decision yourself..... Oh...., I've done something bad, ....and I know it's bad,..... then you break the cycle of karma, ...right?
..... But if you already know.... when you're born .....you were given that information ...
.....without,.., that would be the same as..... what churches tell you to do, ...right? ....
.....This is wrong,... don't do it,..... just don't think about ...why it's wrong, ....or why it's bad.
.....We're telling you.... that it's wrong..... so therefore ....you can't do it.
.... But if you have that information.... you are like, ....you're complete in.... your life.... and on your track and ....you are going somewhere, ...
.....just like, ...oh well, ....that's right,... I did that,.... and I'm not supposed to do that.
... But you have to be able to... at some point,.... at that crossroads, ....make that decision yourself. ..
.......I'm gonna go this way,.. I'm gonna go that way.... because of A and... because of B.

Vivian:

Well, haven't you had experiences .....in your life where, .....ok, I'm sure we've all had really big pitfalls,....... I've had times.... when I've gotten really sick,..... to the point,..... or not just sick ......and hacking and ....I have a cold.
....But ....you know,.... I felt really sick and I felt,.... like, ....wow it woke me up,.... like I don't wanna be drinking every night ....
....and you know, .....you're on a nice roll ......for about a month .....and of course you get back....... into that partying mode.
..... But it's like a, .....you know..... my mother got really sick..... and nothing else is that....... is important anymore,
.......it's kind of enlightens you,...... to a certain point, .......it only lasts so long.
..... But still you hit moments.... in your life..... or there are experiences ......and times in your life..... where it kinda wakes you up ...so to speak.
...And you know, ......you don't necessarily need the church.... to enlighten you, .....life and the events that come along with it, .....it does that for you, ....and for people....,
....for example,.... we hear about,.... like you know..., dope addicts .....or alcoholics they,
..... you know,..... have a point in their life ......where they're just really messed up .......and then they go to A.....A. .....or the church ...for support.
.....It's because they..... need a little more support..... where they can't handle it themselves
......but you know for all of us,.... we go through periods in our life ...............where we are going through enlightenment everyday.

Daisy:

Urn,... personal... growth.

Vivian:

Right and experiences.

Luke:

Yeah, I think it's probably .....the evolution thing ....that's where it's gonna continue.
..... I think that it should be, .....because it is something ....that we share ....with other people too.
...... Maybe that's ....what happens ...with the energy. .....It's not,...... it's not ...created or destroyed..... but maybe it's refined,
.....it becomes more sophisticated.... (Daisy: clarity).... Yeah, we start becoming clearer... as a species as a human,.... as a human community.
...... I think that would be one of the,.... urn,.... one of the hopeful ......outcomes of our continued presence as a species.

Bow:

But what do you know, ....you only use thirteen percent of your brain.

Vivian:

....Ok, but look.

Luke:

....Gotta start using more.

Vivian:

..... But, I mean,..... look at us, ...were in,...... we're not middle-aged yet, .....we're still quite young.
.....I mean, .....compare a child to us,..... and then compare an elderly person.
.....You become...... life becomes sweeter..... for you the older you.... get they say
...... You're more mature, .....your mind is more mature, .....and when you speak to someone...... who's a little bit .......more older they seem nicer don't they?
..... They seen more at ease,..... comfort with themselves.... and their life,.............. they've come to more understanding of everything.
....They're not trying to, ...you know,..... fight against life... like we are everyday... I... mean, .....hopefully anyway we'll still, ......we'll be at that point.... when we get to their age.

Bow:

Well, that's something ....that I believe in...... like why I'm starting to lean....... more toward reincarnation and...... the whole fact of that circle ....or that cycle.
..... It's because.... when you think about.... what we know, ....and what are facts are....., when you're a baby ....you're brought in new.
..... And you don't really.... know anything .....and then you come to a peak...... which is almost like your life is a half circle.
.....So it's like... you're going up ......and hit your peak.......and then you become old ......and senile and you become like a baby again.
....That's life circle..... and then you go the other way around.

Vivian:

....I wasn't talk about going senile..... I was talking about... (Daisy: yeah... wisdom) ....wisdom exactly.

Daisy:

Yeah, .......I do think that, ......that happens as you get older,..... if it doesn't,.... you know, ........it's bad luck for you.
....But you know, .......I think that's important, .....and I think that .....what makes us...... wiser is just life itself.
....Because,.... you live and.... you lose.... and all your losses...... If you're not learning from them,...... then you don't gain.... the gift of the wisdom.

Luke:

Things do go in a line, ....they effect,..... effect your future ....by the choices you make today,...... if you're an imbecile your whole life,...... you're not just all of ......a sudden gonna be an old wise person.

Daisy:

Exactly.

Luke:

And so religion is useful in that,..... in that it sort of gives you a reference point. .....Maybe something if you want to live a just life and stuff, .......you'll end up being a just person at the end of the day,
.....at the end of your life time and stuff, .....and hopefully you'll have picked a couple of things up.
......But it's good to, ....I think it's useful in that, ......yeah it keeps people on a, ........keeps them on a pretty good,... pretty good way to go,.... a pretty good path I guess.

Vivian:

I got an A on this one paper.... in journalism class,.. and it was ....(Luke: Good for you)
..... Well no..... It's sorta has to do with this,... like I was, .....everybody has their nice little topic
...... But I was, .....like I was just kind of trashing everything ..
........you know,... why do we go to school, ....why do we go to elementary school, ....so we can go to junior high. ....Why do we go to junior high, ....so we can go to high school.
..... Why do we graduate ...from high school, ....so we can go to college.
.....Why do we graduate from college,.... oh, so we can work. Why do we work?
......So we can earn money.... for our families.
.... Why do we earn money for our families, ....so we can die and give it, ....pass it on to our children, .....and grandchildren. ....
.....And then so ....what is the point of life ....and why do you.... fight against life............ that whole time until you retire.
.....And then ....when you retire you kind of relent to,... you know, ....you're not fighting anymore,..... you kind of like give into life.
.....You enjoy..... taking walks,..... you enjoy walking through the woods .....and smelling flowers ....and going back to nature, .
......kind of going back to ....simplicity, ......and not so much going with society ....and complexity.

Bow:

.... I know people .....who appreciated those things, now.

Vivian:

...Yeah...

Daisy:

....Well, that's ....what I hope to do, ....you know, .....like they're the values,..... the values that I see in teachers, .....wiser and older people ...than me.
..... I try to live a life,.... it's not easy to.... live a life like that,... but I try to.

Vivian:

We say ....we live that life now, ....sure,.... but then living in a bustling city.
....How many times..... do you really.... look at the stars,.... how many times ...do you go for a hike, ...do you go for a hike?... once a week?
.... No, you don't, .....we are working all day. ....We are inside, ....we're not smelling the roses everyday,
...we go drinking every night instead,..... we smoke all day,.... and uh, ....we eat greasy foods all day,....
..... we're stuck in, ....dark, cold places and...... (Luke: Sorry God,.... sorry God.).... Yeah, ...exactly I'm saying.

Vivian:

We don't really relent ...or give into life.

Luke:

I don't know ....what you're doing a...

Bow:

Nature boy.

Vivian:

I can speak for all of you guys, ...it's true.

Luke:

No it's not.

Daisy:

No it's not.

Luke:

No it's not at all.

Daisy:

Well, having said that .....at least she said,.... brings me back to.... I guess...... my complete belief in ....what spirituality .....and religion is .....that it's very personal..... and what I do....... to make myself a spiritual person.
.... At least, ......she thinks that wisdom ......and spirituality obviously come hand ...in hand and that,....... it is living a healthy life ...and doing these things.
.....But the way .....I um you know, .....have a relationship ....with God .....and the way that ......I express my spirituality.
.... Perhaps it's in a different way, ....that's a personal thing, .....and I believe that's the essence,......
...... what is your ideal.... of your relationship with God,...... and my ideal .............and everybody else's is.... a personal thing.... and that's come form within.

Vivian:

Right, whatever.... you feel,..... if you have,.... you know, .....a nice understanding of,
.... you know,.... what God means to you, ...or what,... you know, ...happiness is to you.

Luke:

Go with it.

Vivian:

Exactly.

Bow:

Yeah, ....I agree,..... but with everything that's been said,.... almost everything..
..... I think that..... it is an inner thing an inner spirituality .....and if you can find that
....., I think you'll be ok,.... you know,.... and uh, .....you know just don't kill people, ...and .......... don't rape and don't pillage ....you know,....... think of you how....... you would like to be treated yourself ...(Daisy: Sure) ...from other people.

Vivian:

I think we all have an understanding of ....what good ....and bad is.... after you've lived a little bit.
...... Everyone has done something bad.... and so, ...we all kind of, .....nobody really wants to live a bad life,
.... we all wanna lead a good life.... and whatever is satisfactory ....to you,... you know,... go with it.

Daisy, Bow:

Amen.

整理文本实际上就是根据语音的句子停顿自然断句，要保证欣赏的心态来练习，比如下面一段的练习，可以看到你是否听出了句子间隔，连接词有的在一个词组的后面，有的在一个词组的前面，看着句子断句，再听着句子调整就做到了精确掌握句子的停顿规律。

句子是流利的，看着就象一些单词的堆积，一个个单词在跳跃着而出，单词都认识，短句子也理解，可是由于他颠三倒四的重复，都是一些没有实际意义的句子，还是不能理解讨论的观点，但是一点几个碎句子连接起来就会有明确的意思。

所以，要想理解，就必须记住语音，要想记住语音，不能直接顺着语音听，这样你即使听一个晚上也不会听懂，因为你听到的是碎句子的堆积，但是你只要连接起来碎句子，就会有了明确的意义。这正是整理文本的意义，就是断过了碎句子，还要断出有一个 完整意义的停顿的大句子，这样说话者的风格就一目了然了，这就是获得语言的感觉了，一个个人物就徐徐如声了。

听的时候听到一些重复的单词，实际上就是英语思维的过程，而这种思维就是想的过程，不是不能中文思维，而是我们平时根本就忘记了我们平时说话的中文思维的过程，原来他们是完全一样的，你交流的越有特色，风趣，越接近我们平时的汉语说话习惯，这个你从电视或者收音机听听说书的汉语对这个问题就理解的更清楚了。其实我们平时说的中式英语，恰恰就是说书面语言语法错误造成的，口语可以是语法的错误变成风趣和幽默，而具有艺术细胞。

你可以一边整理文本一边改正原文的错误，修改了理解全面了，对语音特征掌握了，连人物试探行换词的过程都掌握了，也就理解了，原来说话并不是相好了再说而是边说边想。整理好了文本，英语也就记住了。
    这样的英语碎句子理解很容易，但是他多数都是废话，而废话正是连接思维的润滑剂，理解完整的故事情景和观点不容易，一旦几个碎句子连接起来理解了，就可以完全理解了。整理文本对完整句子也记忆了。所以压码一个完整的长句子是必须要做的事情。
Bow:

Yeah, .....I used to think that ......that's all there was,....
....there was a heaven ....and a hell, ....but now....
... I don't ....think about it, .....because
....I think ....there's just like.... I said earlier,
....there's interpretations of..... heaven and hell,
....to the Buddhists,(uh) ...you know, ...it's like..... being recycled,
....to, ....you know, ....urn, (but that)...to me,.... it doesn't really matter ...what you call it,
... it's just,... eventually,....... we're gonna go somewhere ....and (uh)...we'll find out then,..... you know,.... so,
....I mean...., (it's) I think it's.... like a fear tactic,
....especially for the..... catholic(oh) church.(  oh).... to say like hell.... and describe it.... so vividly,
.....you know.... to say that, ....who wants to go ....there for eternity?
.... you know,..(right)..... of course you're.... not gonna not people, .(um)...and you know.

是否理解记忆？
需要练习压码听语音，你将精力集中到一个个碎句子，摒住呼吸，听完一个句子，再听下一个句子，这就是调整呼吸的一口气听很多句子，慢慢出气能让你舒服一下，你出一点气就可以听一个句子，再出气还能听不少句子，这样你就可以压码很长的完整句子，当然也就理解了，听清一个句子，回想一个句子速度很快，下面说话的人还是反反复复是重复地想着说，你回想着听过的句子，再听着新句子，凡是听清记住的句子就纳入回想的范围，回想多次越积累回想的句子，这就是1，12，123，1234，感觉理解记住了，需要换气的时候已经过去的几个长句子就可以放弃了，开始新的呼气压码听清记忆了。